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Joined: Aug 2001
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The pool light switch has a 15a circuit run to it, I could tie it there. There no #12 bond wire at the switch. I believe the bond for the pool light is bonded at a different point. Probably the panel, or somewhere in the pool filter area, to a water pipe maybe?
The Golden Rule - "The man with the gold makes the rule"
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The way you get around the unspliced grounding wire rule is to run a separate grounding wire for the receptacle. Kind of like running an isolated ground circuit.
A larger problem is the prohibition of fastened-in-place equipment drawing more than 50% of a circuit that contains lights or receptacles. Is this tub fastened in place? If so, it needs to draw less than 10 amps from a 20A circuit.
Mark Kent, WA
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Sounds like this pool light installation has some very serious problems. 300.3 (B) Conductors of the Same Circuit. All conductors of the same circuit and, where used, the grounded conductor and all equipment grounding conductors and bonding conductors shall be contained within the same raceway 680.23 (F) (2) Equipment Grounding. Through-wall lighting assemblies, wet-niche, dry-niche, or no-niche luminaires (lighting fixtures) shall be connected to an insulated copper equipment grounding conductor installed with the circuit conductors. The equipment grounding conductor shall be installed without joint or splice except as permitted in (F)(2)(a) and (F)(2)(b). The equipment grounding conductor shall be sized in accordance with Table 250.122 but shall not be smaller than 12 AWG. originally posted by aldav53 The pool light switch has a 15a circuit run to it, I could tie it there. There no #12 bond wire at the switch. I believe the bond for the pool light is bonded at a different point. Probably the panel, or somewhere in the pool filter area, to a water pipe maybe? 300.3 states that all the conductors of the same circuit are to stay together. 680.23 (F)(2) states that the equipment grounding conductor must be #12 and be insulated In your statement the conductors supplying the pool light is #14 which in itself is a violation. Now you say there is no grounding conductor present at all. 680.42 (C) Interior Wiring to Outdoor Installations. In the interior of a one-family dwelling or in the interior of another building or structure associated with a one-family dwelling, any of the wiring methods recognized in Chapter 3 of this Code that contain a copper equipment grounding conductor that is insulated or enclosed within the outer sheath of the wiring method and not smaller than 12 AWG shall be permitted to be used for the connection to motor, heating, and control loads that are part of a self-contained spa or hot tub or a packaged spa or hot tub equipment assembly. Wiring to an underwater light shall comply with 680.23 or 680.33. The equipment grounding conductor for the pool light is required to be insulated and not smaller than a #12. The spa requires a copper equipment grounding conductor that is not smaller than a #12. I can’t see where the equipment grounding conductor that is already existing complies as is and would not comply to the new spa.
Mike
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There is an exception that allows the grounding conductor to be spliced on a busbar in the switch or transformer enclosure. When I wired my pool I took Mark's route tho. I ran an unspliced green wire to the J box and another (in the same pipe) that grounded the switch and the "within 10-20'" receptacle that was on the light circuit.
Greg Fretwell
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Gfretwell if it will not offend you I would like to make a statement about your post. You posted: There is an exception that allows the grounding conductor to be spliced on a busbar in the switch or transformer enclosure. This is not spliced it is terminated under a screw. Just make sure that the box is listed for the addition of the terminal bar. I hope this doesn’t offend you nor make you mad nor angry or anything like that.
Mike
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No offense taken. In fact I am not even sure what that exception means in the case of a switch, hence my extra EGC
Greg Fretwell
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The pool light is legal with a GFI controlling it. But can I tap that circuit to run to the indoor spa motor. I looked up the specs for the spa motor and it does call for a 15a separate circuit. What if I disconnected the pool light. Or could I leave it connected as long as the customer never used them at the same time. If she did, worse case, it might just trip the breaker. Bottom line is it legal to use a properly sized 15a circuit to run to loads, (each 15a), as long as they aren't used at the same time. Example: I've seen R/V outlets on the inside and out side of a garage on the same circuit. But never to be used at the same time.
The Golden Rule - "The man with the gold makes the rule"
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Can't seem to find the answer.
The Golden Rule - "The man with the gold makes the rule"
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Flip back in your code book a half inch of pages.
210.19 Conductors — Minimum Ampacity and Size. (A) Branch Circuits Not More Than 600 Volts. (1) General. Branch-circuit conductors shall have an ampacity not less than the maximum load to be served.
Greg Fretwell
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originally posted by aldav53: The pool light is legal with a GFI controlling it. But can I tap that circuit to run to the indoor spa motor. I looked up the specs for the spa motor and it does call for a 15a separate circuit. What if I disconnected the pool light. Or could I leave it connected as long as the customer never used them at the same time. If she did, worse case, it might just trip the breaker. Bottom line is it legal to use a properly sized 15a circuit to run to loads, (each 15a), as long as they aren't used at the same time. Example: I've seen R/V outlets on the inside and out side of a garage on the same circuit. But never to be used at the same time. You said that you read the specs of the tub and it calls for a circuit of its own. You have answered your own question. Read 110.3 (B) of the NEC and you will find that the tub CAN NOT be on the circuit with the pool light or anything else.
Mike
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