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#139427 - 11/07/03 01:39 PM VDE vs. OVE  
SvenNYC  Offline
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,691
New York City
Why isn't it DVE as in Deutsche Verband fur Electrotechnick? VDE stands for Verband der Elektrotechnick.

Austria's safety org is OVE: Oesterreichischer Verband fur Elektrotechnik.


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#139428 - 11/07/03 02:46 PM Re: VDE vs. OVE  
C-H  Offline
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,497
Stockholm, Sweden
For the same reason there is a National Electrical Code and not Electrical Code of the USA: The big countries don't need to take other countries into concern.

I noticed a more recent change in the other direction some time ago: On the trains it now says "Die Bahn" as opposed to "Deutsche Bahn"

#139429 - 11/07/03 03:07 PM Re: VDE vs. OVE  
Texas_Ranger  Offline
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,402
Vienna, Austria
No. It's Verband deutscher Elektrotechniker, that means Associaton of German electrical engineers, as opposed to Austrian Association for Electrical Engineering. The Germans just like it more personal [Linked Image]
Didn't notice that thing with the trains. in Austria it's stil ÖBB, Austrian federal railways (no privatization yet, just endless discussions).

#139430 - 11/07/03 04:06 PM Re: VDE vs. OVE  
C-H  Offline
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,497
Stockholm, Sweden

Der VDE ist der Verband der Elektrotechnik, Elektronik und Informationstechnik, ihrer Wissenschaften, der darauf aufbauenden Technologien und Anwendungen. Als Sprecher dieser Schlüsseltechnologien engagiert sich der VDE für ein besseres Innovationsklima, höchste Sicherheitsstandards, für eine moderne Ingenieurausbildung und eine hohe Technikakzeptanz in der Bevölkerung. Seinen Mitgliedern bietet er zahlreiche Vorteile wie den Zugang zu Experten-Netzwerken, Wissenstransfer, Weiterbildung oder exklusive Web-Angebote - für Neumitglieder kostenlos im Eintrittsjahr.

#139431 - 11/07/03 06:50 PM Re: VDE vs. OVE  
pauluk  Offline
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
Norfolk, England
It would be interesting to compare organizations which include the appropriate national name vs. those that don't.

Some with:

ASA = American Standards Association
CSA = Canadian Standards Association
BSI = British Standards Institute
DIN = Deutsche Industrie Norm (Germany)

And without:
NTSC = National Television Standards Committee (U.S.A.)
UL = Underwriters Laboratory (U.S.A.)
IEE = Institution of Electrical Engineers (U.K.)

Oh, and by the way, it doesn't matter what they call our railways in Britain these days.

It takes only one leaf on the line or the wrong sort of snowflake and nothing runs anyway! [Linked Image]

#139432 - 11/07/03 11:23 PM Re: VDE vs. OVE  
Hutch  Offline
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 381
South Oxfordshire, UK
Amongst professional societies the UK is particularly guilty (or is that jingoistic?) in this regard. There is The Royal Society (F.R.S.), The Geological Society (F.G.S) amongst many others… and of course the Royal Navy – everyone knows they’re British… don’t they? Unique in the world, British stamps do not bear the country’s name just the Queen’s head (you’ve guessed which one [Linked Image] ) – something to do with being first apparently.

Ah well, things do change. The old Institute of Geological Sciences is now the British Geological Survey. Thin end of the wedge I say …

Hutch F.G.S.

#139433 - 11/08/03 06:50 AM Re: VDE vs. OVE  
Trumpy  Offline

Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 8,222
SI,New Zealand
Just as a note to you guys from Europe.
I only buy Electricians Tools that are certified by VDE, in that, all of the tools that I use for Electrical work are insulated to a standard, that is Internationally Recognised as a REAL standard.
Just as a note too, all of our Hot-Work Gear is also certified by VDE, before dispatch to us and it gets re-certified in 5 days from here to there and back!!. [Linked Image]

Let's face it, these days if you're not young, you're old - Red Green grin

#139434 - 11/08/03 07:08 AM Re: VDE vs. OVE  
pauluk  Offline
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
Norfolk, England
Good point about British organizations with "Royal" in the title.

There's also:

RNLI = Royal National Lifeboat Institution
RSPCA = Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals
RoSPA = ROyal Society for the Prvention of Accidents

Quite a few official offices use the H.M. prefix, e.g. H.M. Coastguard, H.M. Customs & Excise.

#139435 - 11/08/03 10:38 AM Re: VDE vs. OVE  
djk  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,237
The ESB, Ireland's national power company (since 1927) has always standardised on VDE recomendations although in some instances would tend to go for the "safest" VDE option. E.g when it came to sockeet outlets they recomended VDE class I and banned class II (ungrounded). It was only when the technical committies (ETCI) came along that BS norms started to be considered. E.g. BS1363. Apparently it was highly frowned upon by the safety experts as it was possible to touch the live pins until the 1980s but the construction industry prefered the british system as it was cheaper and in abundent supply and pretty modular (standardised flush boxes etc). They were importing UK style switches and german sockets which didn't fit the switch boxes until this point. It was also quite difficult to source VDE sockets in decorative styles, they tended to come in flush fitting / surface mounted light beige and nothing else. While UK equivilants were available in colours and brass, silver, bronze finishes quite readily. Did VDE ban metal cased socket outlets? I have hardly ever seen a metal schuko outlet.

Oddly enough, as i mentioned in another post the term "schuko" meant absolutely nothing to an electrician here they were refered to as "VDE type 2" or "VDE 16A side earthed." Where did the schuko term come in?

Ireland still has quite a few societies and institutions that have held on to the "Royal" in their title despite having left the common wealth etc since 1932.

Royal Dublin Society
Royal College of Surgeons in Ireland.

Most of the Royal societies in the UK have Irish equivilants that simply replace Royal with Irish or with Irish National.


We still Have the RNLI, Royal National Lifeboats Institute operating life boat services all over Ireland though. one of the few shared UK-Ireland services.

[This message has been edited by djk (edited 11-08-2003).]

#139436 - 11/08/03 11:20 AM Re: VDE vs. OVE  
pauluk  Offline
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
Norfolk, England

As in the children's society? That's one which doesn't have the "Royal" title in Britain. It's NSPCC (National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children).

I think "Schuko" is derived from the translation of safety/security, or protected. I'm not sure if the name came from the recessed design angle, or whether it's to do with the plug design which prevents it being inserted into non-grounded outlets due to the raised ring on the latter.

On BS1363 plugs, the addition of sleeved pins might be a welcome extra safety feature, but I think too much fuss is often made about the lack of sleeving on the original design.

[This message has been edited by pauluk (edited 11-08-2003).]

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