ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
ShoutChat
Recent Posts
Lowes Selling this fan
by timmp - 07/25/21 10:58 PM
How's all our Non-US folks doing?
by djk - 07/23/21 09:13 PM
Switched Receptacles -Top or Bottom?
by donles - 07/23/21 10:51 AM
Do You Travel?
by Bill Addiss - 07/20/21 04:26 PM
Backup Generator Done Right
by timmp - 07/18/21 12:20 PM
New in the Gallery:
February, North East Indiana
February, North East Indiana
by timmp, July 25
Red Green would be proud
Red Green would be proud
by timmp, July 25
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 20 guests, and 14 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 127
S
Member
I hope I don't get run out of Dodge by bringing up multiwire circuits (I still tend to call them Edison circuits even though the configuration, I believe, was intended for DC as Edison HATED AC as most folks know).

Anyway, I have two pairs of existing Edison circuits (four circuits total) that I do not intend to completely re-wire since they work just fine. However, one of these pairs feed the outlets in my kitchen which I would like to GFCI-protect; the second pair feeds the clothes washer and a freezer outlet which I'm debating about GFCI retrofitting.

My questions are:

1) I intend to use two-pole GFCI breakers to accomplish this- are they prone to nuisance tripping in this type of setup?

2) I heard somewhere that GFCI outlets can be used on these IF they are installed at the end of the circuit run(s); is this true?

Yes, multiwire or Edison circuits are like oysters, we either seem to love them or hate them (my brother despises them something fierce but I don't mind them myself); nonetheless, they do have their place. I do not intend to start a debate (war??) on this configuration but merely have some questions on GFCI protection on these types of circuits.

Thank you in advance.


No wire bias here- I'm standing on neutral ground.
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,287
Member
You can install GFCI receptacles on any section of a multiwire circuit, but cannot use the feed through option.
Your multiwire circuit's grounded conductor should be pigtailed at each outlet any way.
Just install the GFCI receptacles individually.
You will need a separate GFCI receptacle for each location...S

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 914
E
Member
You can protect both circuits on the multiwire by putting a GFCI outlet at the first outlet on each line after the circuit splits.

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 127
S
Member
I think what I'll do is put a two-pole GFCI on the kitchen circuits and use solo GFCI outlet(s) on the other two circuits if/when I feel the need for them.

quote:

You can protect both circuits on the multiwire by putting a GFCI outlet at the first outlet on each line after the circuit splits.

I've heard that GFCI outlets do NOT like this on a multiwire configuration... I think electure's point on not using the feedthroughs may be the correct one... I just want to be sure. Maybe I didn't understand the comment correctly???


quote:

Your multiwire circuit's grounded conductor should be pigtailed at each outlet any way.

Indeed. You folks would not believe what I found when I bought this house (well, actually, maybe you would). Someone decided to use the backwire and sidewire slots on the duplex receptacle feeding the clothes washer to split up the circuits!!!!! If this was ever legal, I don't believe it ever should have been. If the device fails, subsequently opening up the neutral, well, you know... WOW! That washer NEVER spun those clothes so dry before [Linked Image] Needless to say, I ripped it out and done it up right.

UTMOST CARE must be taken to ensure neutral integrity on multiwire circuits.

Again, I must thank the host(s) for this fantastic website, and thanks to all of you for your expert advice on matters such as this.




[This message has been edited by Sir Arcsalot (edited 03-14-2004).]


No wire bias here- I'm standing on neutral ground.
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,374
R
Moderator
I would agree with Eelctric Eagle on his response.

Remeber that A GFCI compares the difference between the ungrounded and grounded conductors downstream of the device, not upstream. The GFCI is blind about what is occuring before the device. As long each circuit has its own nuetral after the GFCI you should be OK.


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 308
E
Member
I have installed GFCI on Shared neutral circuits but it kept triping. So i had to pull in an additional neutral.(flex job)
It was very strange to me because a GFCI does not see anyhting upstream from it. But it kept triping. I know there wasn't anyhting on the load side connected.


Edward


Thanks
Edward
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,716
R
Member
Edward, I must ask, what did you mean by
Quote
i had to pull in an additional neutral.(flex job)

Roger

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
I
Moderator
Ed there must have been something else going on.

The feed to any panel is essentially a multiwire circuit and GFCIs work down stream from there


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 308
E
Member
What i meant was that the job was not romex. So i did not run just a grounded(neutral) wire through the studs. I ran an additional neutral through the flex.

I am not sure if there was anything else going on, because as soon as i connected the additional neutral all was working fine.

Edward


Thanks
Edward
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 751
E
Member
Must have hooked them up backwards!


Earl
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Link Copied to Clipboard
Featured:

Tools for Electricians
Tools for Electricians
 

* * * * * * *

2020 Master Electrician Exam Preparation Combos
2020 NEC Electrician
Exam Prep Combos:
Master / Journeyman

 

Member Spotlight
AllClear
AllClear
Belmond Iowa US
Posts: 44
Joined: August 2005
Top Posters(30 Days)
timmp 7
Rachel 4
Popular Topics(Views)
281,451 Are you busy
215,094 Re: Forum
201,958 Need opinion
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5