ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
Shout Box
Recent Posts
Changing a Bulb
by gfretwell. 07/14/18 03:12 PM
Tray cable?
by gfretwell. 07/11/18 10:18 PM
Eaton Heavy Duty 30A and 60A Safety Switches
by Admin. 07/11/18 09:49 PM
ORTOVOX Recalls Avalanche Transceivers
by Admin. 07/11/18 09:44 PM
Tingle off the water spigot
by gfretwell. 07/08/18 12:58 PM
New in the Gallery:
Plug terminals
Housebilding DIY wiring
Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 23 guests, and 17 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Above Ground Pool #164892
06/13/07 06:38 PM
06/13/07 06:38 PM
S
sprynda  Offline OP
Junior Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 11
Cresco, pa usa
Hello to all,
I have a question concerning an above ground pool. I need to run a circuit for two different customers that have installed an above ground pool. One customer has an heater and one does not. I know that i need to run a 20 amp circuit to each to supply the pump motor and that it needs to be on a GFI. Also, if the pool is more that 20 feet away from the home, i need to install a seperate convenience outlet that is also GFI protected. My question is that does the frame of the pool need to be bonded. We have talked to 3 different inspectors and all three told us differnt things. One stated that we need to bond to the frame of the pool, One said that we need to just bond to the lug on the pump and or heater, and one said both. i can not find it in the cose book.
thanks for any help
sam

2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
Re: Above Ground Pool [Re: sprynda] #164902
06/13/07 09:18 PM
06/13/07 09:18 PM
T
Trick440  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 248
Waterford, MI, USA
You need to bond both. The frame and the motor. Also the ladder if its metal and any other metal within 5'.



Shake n Bake
Re: Above Ground Pool [Re: Trick440] #164922
06/14/07 07:10 AM
06/14/07 07:10 AM
S
sprynda  Offline OP
Junior Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 11
Cresco, pa usa
thanks
do you know what section in the code book this is located?

Re: Above Ground Pool [Re: sprynda] #164938
06/14/07 01:09 PM
06/14/07 01:09 PM
G
gfretwell  Offline

Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,242
Estero,Fl,usa
680.26 and in 2005 you are also bonding all paved walking surfaces within 3 feet horizontally from the water's edge. It does not specify height so if you have paving around the pool at ground level(even brick pavers) you may have to provide this grid.
The 8ga bonding grid certainly has to pick up all metal within 5' and all equipment that touches the water circulation path.


Greg Fretwell
Re: Above Ground Pool [Re: gfretwell] #164945
06/14/07 05:56 PM
06/14/07 05:56 PM
HotLine1  Offline

Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,985
Brick, NJ USA
Out of curiousity, you guys in PA....does your areas require any permits for your work?

Article 680 covers pools, and as Greg said 680.26 (2005) for bonding.

As to the receptacles:
AG pool filter, 120 volt, 20 amp twistlock, w/bubble cover no more than 3' from filter motor. (Filters have factory 3' cord w/twistlock cap) Circuit requires GFI protection; CB or deadfront device. You need a general purpose GFI no closer than 10' and no further than 20' from pool.
Bond is #8 solid (bare or green); all metal objects within 5' of pool edge, including heater, filter, frame, ladder, metalic deck/platform, fence, etc.

John


John
Re: Above Ground Pool [Re: HotLine1] #165118
06/18/07 09:08 PM
06/18/07 09:08 PM
S
sprynda  Offline OP
Junior Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 11
Cresco, pa usa
Thanks so much for all the info. It is so confusing when you get three different inspectors telling you three different things. There is alot of cunfusion between an in ground pool and an above ground pool. I was told today that i need to bond at 5 different point around the pool. My question is how do i bond to the pool. I am afraid of drilling into the frame and damagaing the pool or voiding the customers warrentee. As per us guys in PA, i guess it would depend on the town or township you live in. every town is differernt. in my case the owner did not get a permit.
thanks again for the help

Re: Above Ground Pool [Re: sprynda] #165136
06/19/07 06:09 PM
06/19/07 06:09 PM
HotLine1  Offline

Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,985
Brick, NJ USA
Frame bonding is usually done by attaching a listed lug to pool hardware at either the bottom or top where the uprights attach to the rails. Not drilling holes is a real good thing. Star washers (2) on the lug where you attach it.

As to the opinions of the different AHJ's..
the best suggestion I can offer is politely asking 'what Article are you quoting (Sir)'

As to the 'PA way'...I'm aware that the Commonwealth has recently licensed Electrical Inspectors, so on that info I'm assuming that permits are required? Perhaps, not statewide yet?

John


John
Re: Above Ground Pool [Re: HotLine1] #165247
06/23/07 10:03 PM
06/23/07 10:03 PM
G
George Little  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,489
Michigan USA
I think it would be wise to find out if the pool needs any bonding at all by asking if it is by definition, a permanently installed pool or a storeable pool. If it is the later there are no bonding requirements.


George Little
Re: Above Ground Pool [Re: George Little] #165251
06/23/07 11:52 PM
06/23/07 11:52 PM
F
fullyenergized  Offline
Junior Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2
PA
Quote:As to the 'PA way'...I'm aware that the Commonwealth has recently licensed Electrical Inspectors,

Thats funny.I have pictures of a job that a licensed Electrical Inspector passed that had four code violations in a new home.I have also seen other jobs where he pass other stuff that should have failed.



Re: Above Ground Pool [Re: fullyenergized] #165283
06/25/07 12:56 AM
06/25/07 12:56 AM
G
gfretwell  Offline

Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,242
Estero,Fl,usa
There is another way to solve the storable vs permanent pool question in a more practical way. What kind of equipment are they using? Storable pool equipment is not the same as permanent equipment and they are mutually exclusive in their labelling. You can't use one on the other. If they say this is a storable pool, want bonding relief and still use permanent equipment there is your violation.
Storable equipment is usually low voltage, always double insulated and has a 25' attachment cord with a cap on it.
Storable pools are usually all plastic and most inflate.


Greg Fretwell

Featured:

2017 Master Electrician Exam Preparation Combos
2017 NEC Electrician
Exam Prep Combos:
Master / Journeyman

 

Member Spotlight
noderaser
noderaser
Portland, Oregon, United States
Posts: 404
Joined: March 2007
Show All Member Profiles 
Top Posters(30 Days)
Admin 5
Popular Topics(Views)
248,155 Are you busy
185,623 Re: Forum
174,972 Need opinion
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.1
(Release build 20180101)
Page Time: 0.023s Queries: 15 (0.005s) Memory: 1.0126 MB (Peak: 1.1912 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2018-07-21 19:42:25 UTC