ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
ShoutChat
Recent Posts
2023 CEU Course
by renosteinke - 07/12/24 03:26 PM
Counterfeit Code Books?
by Comprehensiveedu - 07/12/24 12:16 PM
Old low volt E10 sockets - supplier or alternative
by gfretwell - 07/11/24 08:51 PM
1&2 family services
by gfretwell - 07/11/24 08:33 PM
Safety at heights?
by gfretwell - 07/10/24 09:23 PM
New in the Gallery:
This is a new one
This is a new one
by timmp, September 24
Few pics I found
Few pics I found
by timmp, August 15
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 440 guests, and 21 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#111683 02/01/07 12:41 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,454
Likes: 3
Cat Servant
Member
Thanks for Norcal for finding this gem on E-Bay. I think it is safe to say that Neither UL, nor Miele, have ever seen this "product."


[Linked Image]


[Linked Image]

Stay up to Code with the Latest NEC:


>> 2023 NEC & Related Reference & Exam Prep
2023 NEC & Related Reference & Study Guides

Pass Your Exam the FIRST TIME with the Latest NEC & Exam Prep

>> 2020 NEC & Related Reference & Study Guides
 

#111684 02/01/07 01:45 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 558
C
Member
Actually that is a Miele product. I have only seen them with a 4-wire cord but they do make them with 3-wire cords. I have a hard time believing they could get a listing on the model with a 3-wire cord.
http://miele.com/pdf/Laundry/W2000LargeCapacityWashers.pdf
Look at page 4.

Curt


Curt Swartz
#111685 02/01/07 03:21 PM
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 650
W
Member
Personal rather than professional note: We bought a Miele washer. Although it is a washer, it requires a 240V supply. It comes with a standard 30A cord cap.

Miele sells the splitter boxes to permit both their washer and dryer to be plugged into a single standard dryer circuit.

The washer manual makes it clear that the washer requires a 15A circuit, but the 30A cord cap seems to imply that a 30A circuit is acceptable.

The washer works quite well, but the nameplate and manual left me with a bunch of questions which I was fortunately able to ignore, since we already had a dryer receptacle but we had a gas dryer.

-Jon

#111686 02/01/07 04:34 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 840
C
Member
Ummm.....before you called this a "counterfeit" UL marking, couldn't you have done some research first? It would have been easy to check Miele's website and also entered the "E-xxxxxx" number into UL's website to double check.

Peter


Peter
#111687 02/01/07 09:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,454
Likes: 3
Cat Servant
Member
Rest assured I did notify UL of this item.

I call it "counterfeit" because of the "complies with" statement on the label. It, strictly speaking, does NOT bear a UL label. The reference seems to imply something else.

Since UL also does plant inspections and follow-up testing, the very idea that someone else's evaluation is equivalent to a UL label is problematic, at best.

The standard listed is not appropriate to the product shown. UL 498 is little more than a collection of plug patterns. It most certainly is not the standard used when a multi-receptacle power strip is evaluated.

That separate ground wire is a major "red flag." Since the NEC requires ALL conductors to be within the same cable, such a construct is not up to UL standards either.

#111688 02/01/07 10:31 PM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 821
S
Member
There's go another 'I've never seen that before' electrical apparatus.

Looks bootleg to me too.

The ground wire is a joke.

#111689 02/02/07 12:14 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 65
B
Member
Quote
I call it "counterfeit" because of the "complies with" statement on the label. It, strictly speaking, does NOT bear a UL label. The reference seems to imply something else.

It's an ETL label. A search on the ETL website does show this product as a listed product. www.etl.com

I do agree, though, that the grounding on this leaves much to be desired. This is essentially a 120/240V "cheater plug." Just like the 120V version, it is very likely that this could end up with an open ground.

UL 1363 (Relocatable power taps) would not apply to this as that standard is only for units rated 20A or less.

[This message has been edited by BrianP (edited 02-02-2007).]

#111690 02/02/07 01:29 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,716
R
Member
Addressing the "conforms to UL standard" issue. Even though UL may set the standard they are not the only NRTL that can list an item as to compliance with the standard.

ETL is just one of many NRTL's out there.

A few more that I see from time to time are CSA, (Canadian Standards Association) ETI, (Electro Test INC) ENT, (Entella) NTS, (National Technical Systems) and more.

Roger

#111691 02/02/07 01:30 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 613
M
Member
I see that it is listed by ETL for the US market. ETL seems to approve a few of the sketchier products and my favorites are puck lights. An Inspector can reject any product he thinks is being misused or violates another part of the code that might not have been recognized when the listing agency gave them the sticker. The itegral equipment grounding conductor could be the killer. I am guessing that ETL thinks that ty raps make the ground integral.

#111692 02/02/07 01:51 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 65
B
Member
Would an inspector ever see this? An inspection is not needed just to install a new washer and dryer. If this is part of a job that is being inspected (new construction or remodel), it shouldn't have a 3-wire receptacle, so this model wouldn't be used.

If the customer knows that a washer/dryer combo such as the Miele will be installed when the wiring is being done (requiring 2 240V receptacles), I would like to see 2 separate receptacles installed by the electrician rather than using an adapter such as this.

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Link Copied to Clipboard
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5