ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
Shout Box
Recent Posts
AreMetal Ladders Ever OK For Electrical Work?
by HotLine1. 01/22/18 07:31 PM
Photocell
by twh. 01/22/18 05:06 PM
VDE 0100 to introduce AFCIs
by sparky. 01/20/18 05:09 PM
MRI LED lights dimmer control replacement - wow!
by Potseal. 01/19/18 08:52 PM
New in the Gallery:
Housebilding DIY wiring
SE cable question
Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 22 guests, and 7 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Transformer Overcurrent Protection #89457
09/16/04 07:31 AM
09/16/04 07:31 AM
M
mistermike  Offline OP
Junior Member
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3
I'm getting differing opinions on the interpretation of Note 2 to Table 450.3(B). I have a 150 kVA, 480-208Y/120 V indoor dry-type transformer feeding three main breaker panelboards. The question comes from the phrase in Note 2 "shall not exceed the allowed value of a single overcurrent device". Is that value for multiple overcurrent devices (a) strictly a maximum of 125% of transformer rated current, or (b) permitted to be as high as "the next higher standard rating" of Note 1 of Table 450.3(B). If "value" means (a), the sum of the three main breakers is limited to 520 A, but if "value" means (b), I can go to 600 A.

2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
Re: Transformer Overcurrent Protection #89458
09/16/04 09:39 AM
09/16/04 09:39 AM
R
resqcapt19  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
IL
Mike,
The value is per note 1, in my opinion. This permits the rounding up to a total of 600 amps for the three overcurrent protective devices. Don't forget that the conductors between the transformer and the panles must be protected per 240.21(C).
Don


Don(resqcapt19)
Re: Transformer Overcurrent Protection #89459
09/16/04 11:41 AM
09/16/04 11:41 AM
R
Ryan_J  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,374
West Jordan, Utah, USA
There is an interesting change to this in the 2005.


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City
Re: Transformer Overcurrent Protection #89460
09/16/04 04:27 PM
09/16/04 04:27 PM
I
iwire  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
North Attleboro, MA USA
Quote
There is an interesting change to this in the 2005.


Ryan is such a code teaser. [Linked Image]

Come on and give it up. [Linked Image]


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
Re: Transformer Overcurrent Protection #89461
09/17/04 08:21 AM
09/17/04 08:21 AM
R
Ryan_J  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,374
West Jordan, Utah, USA
240.21(C) in the 2005 now says that you cannot use 240.4(B) on the secondary side.


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City
Re: Transformer Overcurrent Protection #89462
09/17/04 01:23 PM
09/17/04 01:23 PM
C
cpal  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 162
Cohasset MA
If I'm reading note two correctly it appears to only apply if the primary overcurrent protection is sized larger than 125% of the pri FLA?? In that are compelled to additionally protect the secondary winding.

If the pri OCPD is sized to protect the transformers pri. per 450.3 (B) [pri protection only} , then OCP for the secondary winding is not required.

You may have multiple taps from the secondary of the transformer (as mentioned 240.21 (C) ) to several loads the secondary conductors must be protected per that section and article 240.
If your pri overcurrent protection exceeds 225 A (480/.83)I think Note two is applicable.??


RYAN could you indicate the paragraph in the 05 that references 240.4 I'm looking at the pre-print and appear to be missing it!!

charlie

[This message has been edited by cpal (edited 09-17-2004).]

Re: Transformer Overcurrent Protection #89463
09/17/04 03:24 PM
09/17/04 03:24 PM
M
mistermike  Offline OP
Junior Member
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3
Thanks for all of the feedback. In the end, the local AHJ said we had to stick strictly with 125%; next larger size denied. Sounds like the 2005 NEC will make all of the discussion go away.

Re: Transformer Overcurrent Protection #89464
09/19/04 12:52 PM
09/19/04 12:52 PM
R
Ryan_J  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,374
West Jordan, Utah, USA
From the 2005:

240.21(C) Transfomrer secondary conductors. Each set of conductors feeding seperate loads shall be permitted to be connected to a transformer secondary, without overcurrent protection at the secondary, as specified in 240.21(C)(1) through (C)(6). The provisions of 240.4(B) shall not be permitted for transformer secondary conductors.


*(C)(1)through(C)(6) are the 10', 25', etc., rules, similiar to the 2002.


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City
Re: Transformer Overcurrent Protection #89465
09/19/04 07:29 PM
09/19/04 07:29 PM
C
cpal  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 162
Cohasset MA
Thanks Ryan

The reference to 240.4 (B) was accepted in Comment stage and not in the pre-print.

charlie


Featured:

2017 Master Electrician Exam Preparation Combos
2017 NEC Electrician
Exam Prep Combos:
Master / Journeyman

 

Member Spotlight
Attic Rat
Attic Rat
Bergen Co.,N.J. USA
Posts: 524
Joined: December 2003
Show All Member Profiles 
Top Posters(30 Days)
Admin 20
sparky 15
Potseal 12
Popular Topics(Views)
243,606 Are you busy
180,418 Re: Forum
170,875 Need opinion
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.1
(Release build 20180101)
Page Time: 0.020s Queries: 14 (0.004s) Memory: 1.0001 MB (Peak: 1.1665 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2018-01-24 05:53:36 UTC