ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
ShoutChat
Recent Posts
Voltag Drop
by gfretwell - 08/18/22 08:16 PM
Back From Retirement
by Bill Addiss - 08/16/22 09:19 AM
Upside Down ThreeWay
by gfretwell - 08/12/22 12:30 AM
Load Calcs for EVs and RVs
by gfretwell - 08/12/22 12:24 AM
Wiring method choice
by HotLine1 - 08/10/22 03:39 PM
New in the Gallery:
240/208 to a house
240/208 to a house
by wa2ise, October 9
Now you know.
Now you know.
by Tom_Horne, September 7
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 24 guests, and 18 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
#95082 08/26/05 10:56 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,507
G
Member
Here's a picture of the violation I noted some time ago and I have been assured that the manufacturer will be making a change. Need "in-use cover" if installed in wet location. http://homepage.mac.com/georgelittle/generator_recptacle.jpg


George Little
Stay up to Code with the Latest NEC:


2020 NEC & Related Reference & Study Guides
2020 NEC & Related Reference & Study Guides
Pass Your Exam the FIRST TIME with these Exam Prep Combos:
 

>> Master Electrician Exam Prep     >> JourneyMan Electrician Exam Prep
 

#95083 08/26/05 10:58 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 219
S
Member
But, the receptacle is not in use. Why change it?

Rob

#95084 08/26/05 11:52 PM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,719
Likes: 11
G
Member
I agree with Sierra. The in use cover makes perfect sense when a receptacle is in use but the regular snap cover does a lot better job of keeping the water out when it isn't. Didn't we just have a long conversation about a tiny leak around an EMT fitting? Why force the installer to use a leaky cover on a seldom used receptacle. That is a GFI "nuisance trip" waiting to happen.


Greg Fretwell
#95085 08/27/05 07:40 AM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 706
T
Member
I've never considered an in use cover to be leaky.

Dave

#95086 08/27/05 07:52 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
I
Moderator
I have never believed the NEC should be used as a manufacturing standard.

Here if that unit was listed by an NTL the inspector must accept it as is.

Where I live 90.4 has been amended, in part it says

Quote
shall accept listed and labeled equipment or materials where used or installed in accordance with instructions included with the listing or labeling.

[Linked Image]

Bob


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
#95087 08/27/05 10:38 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 681
P
Member
Bob
I agree it is much easier for an inspector to "APPROVE" listed equipment, but sometimes the listed equipment may have a defect or may have slipped an item in after some UL inspections. What I do is refer the photo like we see here to UL and have them reevaluate the situation. If they say okay, than that is good for me.

NYS requires "inuse covers" for all residential outdoor receptacles that are exposed to the weather (not protected by awnings, etc...).


Pierre Belarge
#95088 08/27/05 12:01 PM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,719
Likes: 11
G
Member
Tiger, the snap cover is gasketed, I have never seen an in use cover that was. Most end up being a pretty loose fit that is terrible if the user isn't very careful to lock it down.
Maybe if you live in a place where the rain always falls in a gentle straight down way that isn't a problem but it rains sideways here as often as not.
Even your garden variety summer shower will be accompanied by 30-40 mph gusts.


Greg Fretwell
#95089 08/27/05 01:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
I
Moderator
Pierre

Quote
What I do is refer the photo like we see here to UL and have them reevaluate the situation. If they say okay, than that is good for me.

That is not an option for inspectors here, listed = approved. [Linked Image]

The problem I have is this.

We can look at the inside of almost any listed equipment and find NEC violations, that outlet may well be wired with 14 AWG and have a 20 amp OCP.

NEC violation yes, but fine if part of listed equipment.

If inspectors start second guessing listings where would they stop?

As you can tell I think our amendment is a good one.

It also takes responsibility or concern away from the inspector for listed equipment.

Lets face it a home generator is a dangerous piece of equipment, fingers can get into moving parts, you can be burnt, the exhaust can kill and of course the electricity can hurt you.

At some point Americans have to be responsible for there own actions.

That cover clearly states.

"Approved for wet locations only when closed"

JMHO, Bob [Linked Image]


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
#95090 08/27/05 01:42 PM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 706
T
Member
I opened a P&S legrand while-in use cover and while not gasketed there is a tongue-in-groove configuration that looks pretty good to me. I could install it and stuff it with some tissue paper to give it a hose test, but the UL listing is good enough for me.

Dave


Link Copied to Clipboard
Featured:

Tools for Electricians
Tools for Electricians
 

* * * * * * *

2020 Master Electrician Exam Preparation Combos
2020 NEC Electrician
Exam Prep Combos:
Master / Journeyman

 

Member Spotlight
cookcc
cookcc
California ,Long Beach
Posts: 28
Joined: May 2007
Top Posters(30 Days)
BigB 6
Popular Topics(Views)
295,191 Are you busy
226,770 Re: Forum
211,914 Need opinion
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5