ECN Forum Forums Code Related Discussion NEC & other Code issues Interesting Observation

The point is that the law does not say you will get a ticket because you drove without a seatbelt in 1958. Therefore the law is NOT ex post facto.

A law that changes something that was previously OK to something prohibited is just a NEW law.

Jim I can not agree with your reasoning.

Generally laws will not make you change something that is existing in order to comply. FLs craziness not withstanding.

Auto emissions would be an example of a new law that does not force old vehicles to comply.

Building codes are certainly another that allow existing to remain 99% of the time.

Sprinkler systems and ADA requirements are a couple items that break that rule but they do not apply to single family homes.

Greg if I got a seat belt ticket in a car that was manufactured before seat belts where installed I would fight it as far as I had to,.... or more realistically as far as I could afford to.

I just came up with a new plan to make me rich and un-famous. I'm going to go to each and every house in my area and tell the homeowners and businessmen that the electrical code has changed and now I want them to install AFCI and GFCI protection on all the circuits that are now required to have said protection. I want EGC's installed in all homes that currently have the 2-wire ungrounded system. Yea, that will happen.Oh, I almost forgot GFP on all 480v. systems over 1200a.

Did you catch the one about AFCI's on existing circuits?? Message here- adding an outlet to a bedroom circuit does not require AFCI protecting the circuit no more than adding a feeder or branch circuit requires adding GFP to an existing 480v. 1200a.Service. Now installing a NEW bedroom circuit requires AFCI on that circuit. The rule is a branch circuit requirement.

George FWIW I think your conclusion is correct and reasonable.

It's nice when both of those conditions are met.

Bob

George, I'm glad you are an inspector. You are reading the Code the same way I do.
I explain to contractors that downstream of what they did has to comply with the Code. If they change the service equipment then they have to add a lot of Code required items. Changing or adding an outlet at the end of a circuit, in my opinion doesn't require upgrading what is upstream of the work.
There are AFCI devices but the Code hasn't caught up to them , it would be nice to be able to add an AFCI receptacle as easily as a GFI receptacle.
Alan

I would say that if there is as much confusion and debate covering the interpertation as is present here then I would fall back on 90-1 practical safeguarding. The reason for the AFCI protection is to give the protection they afford. Until NFPA resolves this dispute then err on the side of safety.