ECN Forum Forums General Topics of the Trade General Discussion Area Determining Square Feet

What happened to the load calculation discussion?

Roger

Roger,
I found out from the appraisal that the HO submitted that the actual HLA is 4800 sqf.

I will post the nameplate ratings of all the equipment on the project that I can get to.

Per the NEC the garage is not counted ( i do not know why they would not count it).

I am curious to know where this ALL ELECTRIC house will come out.

I will post the data this afternoon.

The original topic was how to determine the sqaure foot. I still never got but one solid answer! I ended up blocking it off from the building plan I was given it list the dimensions but as I said it is irregular so it was a jobjust coming up with the sqf.

I guess from now on I will look closer at that.

I may have been leaving some bucks on the table!

I thought the load on a panel is was restricted somewhere? I am almost sure it is.
-regards

Greg

Hi,
NEsparky, there is no zoning or permits where this place is.

There was a building sketch but no electrical etc just floor plan.

thanks for the comment

-regards

Greg

No wonder they call you Mustangelectric!

Giddyup!

Hi,
Coastal what is wrong you sound skeptical? It doesnt always work out that way but I would say that is my average. 60 hours on a job would be a lot.

The most important part of any electrical job is to get paid!

The second most is to PLAN! Planning is a big part of the job.

Knowing what needs to be done is important.

Knowing the NEC and how it pertains to residential work is important.

Having everything you need when you need it is important.

Having the right tools is important.

Having experience is important.

I used to wire a 1200 sqf house in a day or day and a half at the most!

That was when I was in my younger days.

I am not a quick as I used to be but I use my head a lot more.

I always try to use three conductor cable and I use seperate circuits for light and outlets. Most all of my lights go on Arc fault and I share bath circuits.

I use a lot of gfi outlets.

I try not to use any 3 ways or 4 ways if possible.

First I put in the service and the grounding.

Then I lay out my boxes and nail them up, then i drill out my holes using a 7/8 bit. Then I put up all the stuff in the ceiling like ceiling boxes , fan boxes and recessed cans as well as smokes and doorbell. Then i pull all the heavy stuff. Then i will run the lighting circuits. Then the outlets. Then run all my home runs.

I cut switch legs on a 45 and bend the ends of power...that makes it simple...mark everything at the panel as I run it.

Then I will make up what I can and test ALL OF THE RECESSED CANS!

Once sheetrock is up and paint is on then i come back and trim out and put up lights.

Now it doesnt matter how fast i do it, excpet when the insulator is crying to get in! Besides there is nobody but me to get it done!

Loads of fun!

-regards

Greg



[This message has been edited by mustangelectric (edited 01-04-2005).]

All due respect, I think the $204 per hour is highly misleading.

What about taxes, insurance, cell phone, vehicle depreciation, vehicle insurance, vehicle maintenance, tools and supplies, unbilled labor (time to get materials, time for billing and estimating), permit fees (if necessary), time to apply for permits, travel time, etc etc.

Factor all that and whatever else I forgot and you are not making $204 per hour.

Peter D.


[This message has been edited by CTwireman (edited 01-04-2005).]

Not skeptical; simply bemused!

Just visualizing a 5000+ sq. ft. home with a little 200 Amp meter can outfitted to the side of the garage brings a smile to my face.

My typical 5000+ sq. ft. home consists of 90+ recess cans, 2 Master bedroom Suites, 6 Guest bedrooms, 2 Media Rooms, Game Room, Elevator, 4 zones HVAC (20-30KW), 4 water heaters, 2 whirlpool tubs, 2 wet bars....(taking deep breath)...
4 kitchen circuits, 2 microwaves, 2 dishwashers, disposal, wine cooler, instant hot, ice maker, 2 cooktops, wall oven, under cabinet and cove lighting.....
(another breath)....
Swimming Pool, Hot Tub, Tiki Bar, Sauna, Steam showers, 600 Amp Service with CT cabinet and switchgear....etc. etc.

It takes a whole herd of "Mustangs" to wire these rascals in a week!

Hi,
Coastal how the heck do you fit all of that in 5K sqf?

My clients are frugal!

I just figured up everything in the place, here is a list:

Electrical Survey: XXX Residence
Item-Quantity-Watts
Recessed Light-40-4 kW
Ceiling Fan-6
Light Outlet-19
Vent Light Combo-3
Vent Fan-1
Single Pole Switch-52
Stack Switch-8
3 Way Switch-8
Receptacles-62
Porch Lights-10
Bath Bar Light-3
Telephone-10
TV-9
Smoke Detector-7
Sconce Lighting Outlet-5
GFCI-16
200A Service-1
100A Sub Panel-1
240 VAC Outlet 20A-1-4.8 kw
240 VAC Outlet 30A-2-10 kW
240 VAC Outlet 40A-1-AC
240 VAC Outlet 50A-1-8 kW
240 VAC Outlet 60A NA
Flood Lights-3
Decorative Lighting-2
Switched Outlets-3
Dimmers-10
Fluorescents-3
Closet Light-8
Spa-1
Dishwasher-1
Refrigerator-1
Disposal-1
Under Cabinet Lighting-3
Chandelier-2
Door Bell-1
AC-1-9.6 kW
Heat-1-28.8 kW

Lot of stuff but not near as much as you!

4800 SQF. No nameplate for heat so I used the 60A rating for each heater. The ac is 38A max.

-regards

Greg



[This message has been edited by mustangelectric (edited 01-04-2005).]

I just finished a 5200 sq.ft. custom home. It had 325 openings. By openings I count recepts, switches, light provisions as openings. I price a job at $35.00 per opening(steel boxes)plus $85.00 for each 240V cooking appliance, $75.00 for elect dryer.$2850.00 for a 320A. TV and phone are $30.00 an opening and OHD pre-wire(buttons, beams and recept) are $150.00 per door. I don't know how you could avoid 3 way and 4 way switches in a 5000 sq.ft. house. I work by myself and the 5200 sq.ft. house I just finished took me a lot longer than 60 hours to install the service, rough it in and trim it out. If you can do it, my hat's off to you.

Fred,
Thanks for the reply. It is interesting to see what kind of prices are being charged out there.

This is 4800 sqf. This house probably has 200 openings.

If you look at the list of stuff I installed you will see that it is not near what you described.

I forgot to mention that dad opened the trench and closed it too so that saved me some time.

The builder drilled all the exterior holes.

I think I will start charging for OH door controls..I like the way you think!

Not all jobs go the same!

thanks again.

-regards

Greg


[This message has been edited by mustangelectric (edited 01-04-2005).]

[This message has been edited by mustangelectric (edited 01-04-2005).]