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#41707 09/06/04 08:34 AM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 697
Dave55 Offline OP
Has anyone noticed the conflict between architects and builders?

I think architects look at builders as a necessary evil, and builders wish that architects would draw the prints and go away.

My personal experience with them has been an architect that I worked for locally. He pulled in these great projects, but then tried to act as the general contractor. It was a disaster. He had the eye of an artist, but no business sense. I ended up working directly for the homeowners & did well. I think he ran into the city or park disrict lawyers and faded away.

On the other hand, if I were doing an addition and I wanted it to look pasted onto my house, I'd get a builder. If I wanted an addition that looked like it was built with the house, I'd get an architect.


#41708 09/06/04 08:44 AM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 751
I have run into some architect/builder teams that work quite well together. I guess the trick is to respect what each can contribute to the total package and TALK to each other.

#41709 09/06/04 04:12 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,876
e57 Offline
Oh, I could go on and on! I'll try to limit though. I have come across great Arch's, and total F'up's.

The good: Are experianced, well learned in all trades, and have either done thier time and gained experiance, or worked in one trade or another early on. (Worked for one who was both an apprentice carpenter, and apprentice to Frank Loyd Write at the same time, a joy to work with!)

The bad: Still think 2x4's are 2x4", and have no idea what happens past the sheet rock, nor do they care. They'll draw up plans with no sembalance of scale, do 10 sheets A - M, and never once over-lay them! Never learn from THIER mistakes, and pass the blame to everyone else, and do it for years. ( Once had one get so freaked out after having every trade on a job batter him with questions and details, he bolted for the door, hopped in the BMW, backed into a pole, and burned rubber out of there.)

Truth is: They, like us, have those who know what they are doing, and those who do not. We have Electricians out there, who for lack of better words, do sub-standard work. And they have 1st year "Design" students who call themselves Architects. Like us, some sort of License, or Certification is required in most places to at least know they are at least minimally qualified. And, like us sometimes those Licenses and Certifications are over-looked for the least expensive guy without one.

Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason
#41710 09/07/04 05:07 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 599
I got the following from this forum a couple of years ago. Unfortunatly it describes the architect I am currently working with to a "T"

Supplementary General Conditions
Article 1
The work we want performed is clearly indicated on the attached plans and specifications. The Architect, who has had plenty of college, has spent a lot of time drawing up these plans and specifications, but nobody can think of everything. Once your bid is submitted to the Owner-that's it brother! From then on, anything wanted by the Architect, the Owner, or any of his friends, or anybody else except the Contractor shall be considered as shown, specified, intended, or implied, and shall be provided by the Contractor without any expense to anyone except the Contractor.
Article 2
If the work is done without extra expense to the Contractor, then the work will be taken down and done over again until the extra expense to the Contractor is satisfactory to the Architect.
Article 3
The contract drawings are intended to be correct. If drawn wrong it should be discovered by the Contractor, corrected, and done right at his own expense. It won't cut any ice with the Owner or the Architect if the Contractor points out the mistakes which the Architect has drawn on the plans.
Article 4
The Contractor is not supposed to make fun of the Architect, his plans, or specifications. If he does, then the same consequence shall apply as stated in Article 3 above.
Article 5
Any Contractor walking around the job site with a smile on his face will be subject to a review of his bid.
Article 6
If the Contractor doesn't find all the Architect's mistakes prior to making his bid on this job, or if he doesn't have enough sense to know that the Architect is going to think up a bunch of new stuff that has to be done before the job can be deemed complete, then the Contractor shall provide any such items without extra expense to the Owner or Architect.
Article 7
Any evidence of satisfaction on the part of the Contractor shall be considered as just cause for withholding final payment.

#41711 09/07/04 09:08 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,876
e57 Offline
Nick, that list could go on and on!

"Just make us happy, what-ever YOUR cost."

Boris, and Nastashia Design....
[easterneuropeanaccent]"Make eet haighpin like heeer in de carrtooon! Or veee keel you!"[/easterneuropeanaccent]

Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason

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