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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 494
I tell you what I can not understand and that is why some people feel that just because they are from a certain place that the code doesnt apply to them. For instance, up here in an unamed town which is booming right now, it is reportedly allowed to use #14 on a 20A ckt, switches do not have to be grounded and romex can be pulled tight into the box, derating doesnt matter and you do not need an electrical apprentice or journeymans license even though everybody else in the state has to have a license and adhere to the code..

this is the problem electricians are facing out in the US today..there are too many ways to get around the system..most of this work has a permit on it and will most likely pass inspection..

i hear the contractor crying about call backs and rework and lost profits..DUH

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,044
Tom Offline
If you could search the archives on this forum, Sparky66WV covered part of this a long time ago. He was rightly upset about having to compete against carpenters, handymen, etc who could make it work, but not make it safe.

You've got my sympathy. It seems like for every highly qualified electrician, there are 10 jacklegs.

BTW, what is up with the AHJ in that town? He and/or the city is not immune from lawsuits, maybe it will take a fire or other accident to catch his attention.

Of course, he might be wearing blinders like one here in WV. I have a great picture of an above ground gasoline tank & dispenser, complete with open air splice and unsupported switch box located right next to the pump. It sure makes the seal installed next to the box look like a waste. The tank is right behind city hall & is used for fueling city vehicles, including the one that the AHJ drives.


Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,876
e57 Offline
Hey your not in Northern California?!!!

You mean that is happening somewhere else too?

There are some areas that the only inspection is from the tax assesors office. Otherwise people do what they please.

Then again, some places ill-concieve, and invent codes on thier own too. Some of them shoot for the cheap...(and accept hack work) Ever think that the reason it is booming there is that it's really inexpensive to build? Funny thing is, is that when it's booming somewhere else, these people will have no idea what to do!

Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 558
Here in my home county,there's no electrical,plumbing or Hvac permits ot inspections.

We lose WAY more bids than we get,and some of the work around here is downright scary.

People who have "done some wiring" will wire a house for $12-15 an hour. Hard to compete with that kind of pricing.

Lost a bid last year on a Church. All Churches in my state must be done in MC cable at a min. Guy wired the place in nm-b,with some of the members helping for $15 an hour.

Seems now the're having a tough time getting insurance. Oh well,they saved money on the electrical tho.

It's very frustrating,and I've considered getting out of it several times in the last 6 mos. But hopefully someday it'll change.


Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 106
Keep up your quality work and when the buildings you've wired are the only ones that haven't burned down or killed someone, you will be the most popular electrician in town. You WANT to lose most of your bids or else you can be sure you are working too cheaply!

Power to the people
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 914
Hey Russell you just need to move a few miles south, In the north metro area we don't have any shortage of customers willing to pay a premium price for a premium job. Yes, there are hacks and handymen, but we are competing for a different customer base.

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 20
I finished up a job a few days ago where I was called to do some Code updates and replace a ton of fixtures/switches for the H/O who is selling their house. 90% of the house I could tell was wired by an experienced electrician and it made my work easy. But when I got to the finished part of the basement which was done after the house was completed, I ran into some nightmares (I will post a pic later). The H/O told me a carpenter did the whole thing (plumbing, HVAC, elect., etc). And this was done in an area of the city that requires a permit & inspections. I don't know how it passed. I share in your frustration! But after I finished, I made it right and up to Code, so the next H/O can move into a safe house.

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