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Plumber doing electrical?? #206346
06/17/12 08:41 PM
06/17/12 08:41 PM
HotLine1  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,039
Brick, NJ USA
Found this on a re-inspection. No GFI, no cover on receptacle, open KOs...

[Linked Image]

Last edited by HotLine1; 06/17/12 08:41 PM.

John
Tools for Electricians:
Re: Plumber doing electrical?? [Re: HotLine1] #206377
06/22/12 11:08 AM
06/22/12 11:08 AM
JoeKP  Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 144
Berkley, MA
Shower of sparks wink


-Joe
“then we'll glue em' then screw em'”
-Tom Silva
TOH
Re: Plumber doing electrical?? [Re: HotLine1] #206380
06/25/12 02:48 AM
06/25/12 02:48 AM
A
Albert  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 78
Falls Church, VA
Is the 45 going into the box a chrome shower arm?

Re: Plumber doing electrical?? [Re: HotLine1] #206381
06/25/12 08:31 AM
06/25/12 08:31 AM
HotLine1  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,039
Brick, NJ USA
Yes sir! That it is!


John
Re: Plumber doing electrical?? [Re: HotLine1] #206382
06/25/12 03:05 PM
06/25/12 03:05 PM
renosteinke  Offline
Cat Servant
Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,316
Blue Collar Country
I never thought of that ... a shower arm .... well, you've got to admire his resourcefullness!

Now ... let's open our minds a bit, and ask "what's REALLY wrong with this installation?"

That is, let's overlook all the 'pro forma' things like the lack of a UL sticker. Instead, let's pretend we're standing in the lab at UL, and this kludge comes in to be evaluated for listing.

What points would you focus on? Could something like this pass muster?

Re: Plumber doing electrical?? [Re: HotLine1] #206383
06/25/12 03:11 PM
06/25/12 03:11 PM
HotLine1  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,039
Brick, NJ USA
1/2" IMC/RGC & a bender with some talent could rectify this.

"It works"?? Yes, is there a equip ground path? Yes! Even thru the plumbing copper fitting. Could UL or any RTL be OK with this? Perhaps. But....paying the $$$$$ for evaluation IMHO is not cost effective. (See opening line of this post)



John
Re: Plumber doing electrical?? [Re: HotLine1] #206393
06/27/12 11:06 AM
06/27/12 11:06 AM
L
LarryC  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 783
Winchester, NH, US
Would the surface finish of the interior of the pipe and fittings be a cause for concern? Specifically the edges of the threaded portions.

Re: Plumber doing electrical?? [Re: HotLine1] #206394
06/27/12 01:50 PM
06/27/12 01:50 PM
HotLine1  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,039
Brick, NJ USA
Judging on the workmanship...probably NM in the pipe.



John
Re: Plumber doing electrical?? [Re: HotLine1] #206398
06/28/12 04:01 PM
06/28/12 04:01 PM
renosteinke  Offline
Cat Servant
Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,316
Blue Collar Country
Hotline, I wasn't referring to a one-off 'field evaluation.' I was asking ... what's really wrong here?

I'm a bit disappointed in the lack of thoughtful replies. Maybe I should give it a try ...

Code already requires the pipe ends to b free of burrs and sharp edges.

Let's look at that shower arm as if it were any other piece of conduit:
OK, I see threads. Would it pass muster as IMC? After all, there are strength and wall thickness requirements for IMC.
There's also a minimum bending radius. Does this comply?
One difference between plumbing pipe and electrical pipe is that the ASTM standard specifies that the inside of electrical pipe be 'smooth.' In practice, this means that the lengthwise ridge formed when the pipe was welded together has been removed. What does the inside look like here?
I expect the plating does give enough corrosion protection.

What about copper pipe / tubing? Well, if you look at the relevand product standards, there's always room for alternative materials of similar strength. Maybe one of the copper tubing grades would pass muster as EMT.

A problem arises with the fittings, as code tells us we cannot rely upon solder alone for our connections. Now, if they used an old-style 'dimpler' together with solder, they'd be good to go.

Let's look at that Bell box. First off, what's to keep the connection from coming loose? I'd want to see a locknut there.
Just as important, code requires the box to be supported by at least two conduits, where conduitprovides the support. I only see one.

Open KO's, etc., are issues that would apply to any installation.

Re: Plumber doing electrical?? [Re: HotLine1] #206401
06/28/12 10:15 PM
06/28/12 10:15 PM
H
harold endean  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,233
Boonton, NJ
Gee John,


A plumbing shower arm for electrical work. What's wrong with that? Now your getting picky! smile

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