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#201991 07/07/11 09:56 PM
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I was pasting some pipe today and it occurred to me, do you use primer on RNC?


Greg Fretwell
gfretwell #201992 07/07/11 10:01 PM
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Greg:

No, never did personally. IMHO, per mfg instructions (Carlon, last I looked) they only sold glue. A little caveat to this subject, their instructions allude that the PVC 'system' to be UL listing compliant MUST all be from same mfg; Carlon in this case.





John
gfretwell #201995 07/08/11 01:56 AM
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Has anyone actually failed a job for not using Carlon cement?

What if you had Carlon pipe and Cantex fittings. Would you use 2 different cans of cement? (one on each side)

My real question was more directed to cleaning dirty pipe. Do you think that is a good idea? A plumber/plumbing inspector will tell you that the primer makes that joint several times stronger, particularly if the pipe is dirty.

BTW maybe the lack of primer is why Carflex is not listed in a cemented fitting. I guarantee you, if you prime it and glue it, the fitting will pull out of the box before the joint fails.


Greg Fretwell
gfretwell #201997 07/08/11 03:54 AM
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I would not red tag a job if a different brand of glue was used then the pipe providing the glue used was listed for use on electrical PVC conduit. No different then mixing pipes of different makers IMO


"Live Awesome!" - Kevin Carosa
gfretwell #201999 07/08/11 04:21 AM
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Quote
I would not red tag a job if a different brand of glue was used


That sort of blows away the 110.2(B) thing then doesn't it?
The manufacturer instructions say to use THEIR cement. wink

At a certain point this becomes the classified breaker argument.

BTW I bet if you look at Carlon cement, Cantex Cement and Oatey (plumber's cement) the MSDS will say they have the same ingredients.

At any rate that was not where I was going

I was just curious if anyone cleans the pipe with primer and I got that answer.

No.


Greg Fretwell
gfretwell #202000 07/08/11 10:37 AM
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Does wiping it off with my hand count. That's the only cleaner the pipe gets.

gfretwell #202003 07/08/11 01:21 PM
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I suppose it depends on whether you care if the joint pulls apart.


Greg Fretwell
gfretwell #202004 07/08/11 03:21 PM
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Greg:

My comment re: Carlon was something that came up a few years ago. NO, I did not fail anyone, nor am I aware of anyone that failed, other than one (1) instance of this issue. The supporting data was mined from the Carlon mfg installation PDF via Carlon website.

As to cleaning PVC, with my EC hat on, practice was to wipe the ends & bell with a clean rag before applying glue. I do not remember any pull aparts.

Should I apologize for going off your original inquiry.....sorry!



John
gfretwell #202006 07/08/11 05:00 PM
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Primer is certainly something to consider.

I've had too many joints fail, especially on the larger pipe. Oddly enough, the type of glue used, and the weather, seemd to be the biggest factors.

The 'electrical' glue is pretty thin; add a hot sun and lower air pressures at altitude, and you have a prescription for the stuff to dry much quicker than you can assemble the pieces.

Oddly enough, some of the 'plumbing' stuff - like the gray glue - has a heavier body and allows for a longer working time. Using primer also seems to aid the working time. The PVC 'cleaner' they sell (clear rather than purple) seems to extend working time as well. The 'cleaner' is nowhere near as aggressive a solvent as the primer.

I note that the plumbing code requires the use of primer. Naturally, we are not concerned about any 'leaks' in our pipe; it's the wire insulation that keeps the electricity inside.


gfretwell #202007 07/08/11 05:09 PM
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Interesting topicÖ Out of habit, I use primer on all the NM pipe and conduit fittings I install, whether itís for pressure or just electrical wiring. Iíve never seen where primer was required, but I also donít really see where itís not allowed.
Thereís no doubt in my mind that it makes for a much stronger faster setting, joints that are impervious to water seepage. Granted with conduit, you may still get condensation accumulation inside, but at least there wonít be additional water leaking in from the joints themselves.
Unless you actually saw me using it though, you probably would never know I had, since I normally use the Rectorseal PR-3 clear PVC/CPVC primer.

As far as the Carlfex being cemented directly in FS box fittings, Iíve seen that done on dock wiring before and I would agree that is the strongest, most durable and watertight connection that can be made. It looks like it would make for much easier wire pulls as well.
Iíll bet the only reason Carlon doesnít get its Carflex UL listed for installation that way is because they would lose all that money they make for their required crappy Carflex connectors.

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