ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
ShoutChat Box
Recent Posts
You will never guess
by grich - 02/24/21 07:18 PM
Lock-down Thread
by Bill Addiss - 02/24/21 04:40 PM
New tool
by SMOKEYBOB - 02/15/21 04:59 PM
Split Bus Breaker Panel
by gfretwell - 02/15/21 02:30 PM
Sierraplex recpts
by gfretwell - 02/15/21 02:27 PM
New in the Gallery:
Facebook follies, bad wiring
FPE in Germany pt.2
Who's Online Now
1 registered members (Scott35), 15 guests, and 19 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Wiring Method/Material Question #181453 10/08/08 05:58 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,634
Admin Offline OP
Administrator
Member
Quote
Hi,

Can someone provide identification and/or additional information for this material, found at the basement ceiling in a Park Ridge IL House built (according to tax records) 1944/45? - it's a bit different from any K&T wiring method/material I have encountered previously, and I'd like to precisely identify it in my report..


Michael T.

[Linked Image from electrical-photos.com]

[Linked Image from electrical-photos.com]

Tools for Electricians:
Re: Wiring Method/Material Question [Re: Admin] #181455 10/08/08 06:20 PM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 745
E
EV607797 Offline
Member
That looks like a K&T transition to a box. The loom is placed over the individual conductors before they enter a box. I seriously doubt that is was installed in 1944/45 though. They were using BX and even non-grounded Romex at that time.

Not to mention, hasn't the Chicago area (union) always required that wiring be in conduit since the beginning of time?


---Ed---

"But the guy at Home Depot said it would work."
Re: Wiring Method/Material Question [Re: EV607797] #181457 10/08/08 06:42 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 853
L
leland Offline
Member
Agreed, clearly a transition. As far as dateing.. Pre-40s', but I'm in New England and am not aware of the rest of the country at that time.

Re: Wiring Method/Material Question [Re: leland] #181465 10/09/08 08:35 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 36
J
junkcollector Offline
Member
There is a definite wire color difference- looks like one wire has a yellow insulation and the other is red? Seems odd.

If those are a hot and grounded conductors I was under the impression that there needed to be more separation and they can't be on the same knob, which was why cleats were used.

Re: Wiring Method/Material Question [Re: junkcollector] #181477 10/11/08 10:20 AM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 853
L
leland Offline
Member
Perhaps a switch leg? Explaining the same insulator.
Asfar as color, I have seen alot of this with the later K&T.
Shortly before the transition to cables.

Re: Wiring Method/Material Question [Re: leland] #181486 10/11/08 01:29 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,233
H
harold endean Offline
Member
That is old K&T wiring. As stated the loom was used when the single conductor wire turned corners. When wire was run in a straight line paralel to the floor joist, the K&T would rest under the individual knobs or when the crossed through the beams then the ran in the tubes. When you were running from the ceiling and wanted to turn down a wall. They electrician would slide the loom over the single 14 ga RH wire. It prevent the wire from chafing on the wooden beams. Here in northern NJ there is still a lot of K&T wiring in homes around here. Also as stated the loom would protect the singel strand wire when it entered a box.

Re: Wiring Method/Material Question [Re: EV607797] #182926 12/18/08 07:07 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 41
C
cschow Offline
Member
Originally Posted by EV607797


Not to mention, hasn't the Chicago area (union) always required that wiring be in conduit since the beginning of time?


I remember that too. K&T was mostly prevalent out West after the 30's. However, judging by the fact that the wire spacing is not to code, even by early K&T standards, and 2 wires on 1 knob, I vote this is an old homeowner hack job.

Re: Wiring Method/Material Question [Re: cschow] #182927 12/18/08 09:56 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,233
HotLine1 Offline
Member
Two (2) wires on 1 knob? They are designed/mfg for two (2) conductors.

As mentioned above, 'loom' was used at box entry points, and the conductors would have to be closely spaced to enter a device box; hence the 'loom'!

What 'code' are you referencing for wire spacing?



John

Featured:

2020 National Electrical Code
2020 National Electrical
Code (NEC)

* * * * * * *

2020 Master Electrician Exam Preparation Combos
2020 NEC Electrician
Exam Prep Combos:
Master / Journeyman

 

Member Spotlight
The_Lightman
The_Lightman
Orlando, Fl, USA
Posts: 49
Joined: August 2001
Show All Member Profiles 
Top Posters(30 Days)
Popular Topics(Views)
275,352 Are you busy
209,224 Re: Forum
196,526 Need opinion
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3