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Oversize Plates #153667 10/30/03 08:10 AM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,283
electure Offline OP
Member
Per NEC 314.21Repairing Plaster and Drywall or Plasterboard.
Plaster, drywall, or plasterboard surfaces that are broken or incomplete shall be repaired so there will be no gaps or spaces greater than 3mm (1/8") at the edge of the box or fitting.

OK, then, does anyone ever enforce this? There are plates made with the express purpose of covering oversize cuts. (Ironically, I've even seen them advertized as such in the IAEI magazine).
What do you think?...S

Building Codes & Related References
Re: Oversize Plates #153668 10/30/03 10:06 AM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,374
R
Ryan_J Offline
Moderator
I am usually more concerned about it in a rated wall than an average installation. Like you said, the over-sized plates will cover it before I will see it.


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City
Re: Oversize Plates #153669 10/30/03 10:56 AM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,961
Bill Addiss Offline
Member
I always thought the only way the use of these could be justified is to cover up some irregularity in the wall finish (ie Paint, Wallpaper), not oversized holes.

What did the ad in the Magazine say?

Bill


Bill
Re: Oversize Plates #153670 10/30/03 11:47 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 457
J
Jim M Offline
Member
Scott,

I have yet to see an inspector pull off more than a panel cover. So it seems that what doesn't get seen will get passed.

Should my inspection fail for work that I didn't do, i.e. the sheetrock? Who should fix those gaps?

Re: Oversize Plates #153671 10/30/03 01:04 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 552
T
txsparky Offline
Member
I agree with Bill's perspective as to the use of these.There is no excuse for a carpenter or drywall hanger to leave an oversized hole around the box for the electrician to have to deal with.. I never hesitate to call this to their attention, and the attention of their superiors if need be. Sometimes it ruffles their feathers, but who cares. Occasionally I have had to quote NEC 314.21 to them. Then I let them know that the oversized holes are to be repaired or I don't trim out !! No exceptions.


Donnie
Re: Oversize Plates #153672 10/30/03 01:47 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,716
R
Roger Offline
Member
I have worked with an engineer who spec medium size plates for all struck block jobs. This makes good sense do to the fact even the best masons can't make all cuts that tight.

As far as 314.21, I brought this up in the BC area questioning why this is not in 314.20. It seems we could toss out 314.21 if it were.

The UL orange book states any box in a rated wall will not have more than an 1/8" gap therfore overridding the NEC laxness. (is that a word [Linked Image])

Roger

Re: Oversize Plates #153673 10/30/03 02:36 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,961
Bill Addiss Offline
Member
Is the space around th ebox addressed in the Building Code somewhere?
Or is it only found in the Electrical Code?

It seems to me it should be in both places, especially if they want it to be enforced.

Bill


Bill
Re: Oversize Plates #153674 10/30/03 03:34 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 552
T
txsparky Offline
Member
Quote
even the best masons can't make all cuts that tight.
No, but they can fill the gaps with mortar,just as a sheetrock finisher can fill the gaps with tape and mud. [Linked Image]

[This message has been edited by txsparky (edited 10-30-2003).]


Donnie
Re: Oversize Plates #153675 10/30/03 06:22 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 67
P
pwood Offline
Member
bill,
section 709.6 calif.bldb. code(1997 ubc)addresses the firestopping methods.in concrete walls ;concrete,grout,or mortar the full thickness of the wall or the thickness required to maintain the rating is o.k.fire caulking or other listed systems are acceptable in other types of walls.
the material used to fill the annular space shall prevent the passage of flame and hot gases sufficient to ignite cotton waste when subjected to ubc standard 7-1 time temperature fire conditions under a minimum positive pressure differential of 0.01inch of water column(2.5pa)at the location of the penetration for the time period equivelent to the fire rating of the construction penetrated.that's the technical explanation!

Re: Oversize Plates #153676 10/30/03 06:28 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,716
R
Roger Offline
Member
Donnie, the gaps aren't a code issue in CMU construction. Set back is. The plates are only for a clean finish on the exposed block.

The masons always mud in behind the boxes and point them up anyways.

Roger

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