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Re: Wiring Location in Walls #143814 09/21/05 04:58 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,250
djk Offline
Paul, our house has a rather different set up to that.

The external walls are concrete block which is plastered and painted.

There is then a layer of foam insulation, then the cavity then another layer of blocks that form the internal walls. They are battoned and covered with fiberglass insulation then a moisture membrane then plasterboard which is skimmed with plaster and painted.

The internal walls are solid block construction which is then plastered. The electrical fittings and cables are, for the most part, burried in this plaster (in conduit)

The floors are concrete with a fine screde on top. (there's a layer of insulation and damn proofing obviously too)

The heating pipes (pair of copper pipes) that feed the radiators are burried in thick insulation in the concrete.

We also have some runs of cable burried in the floors feeding outlets in hallways.

This is then all covered by a "floating" wooden (ash) floor which sits on a layer of foam insulation to reduce noise and to provide some extra thermal insulation.

(Tiles in the bathrooms)

Upstairs is all solid hardwood flooring (the main living area)

The house is build on a slope so is split level with the bedrooms on the lower level and the living area on the upper level to maximise the view.

There's also a narrow basement area that runs the length of the house and carries most of the wiring and plumbing.

All the wiring is radial & is fed from a 4 row Hager distribution board (consumer unit)

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Re: Wiring Location in Walls #143815 09/21/05 12:57 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 803
mxslick Offline
Real estate prices are just insane in Britain these days. Take a look here for an idea of what's on offer:

Multiply Sterling prices by:

1.8 to get U.S. dollars
2.4 for Australian dollars
2.6 for New Zealand dollars

And I thought prices in California were insane.. (median price here is $489,000.00US)


From your description, it would seem that your home is highly energy efficient.

I'm curious, in construction as yours, how does one do additions/remodels? It would seem to require major plaster work....

Stupid should be painful.
Re: Wiring Location in Walls #143816 09/22/05 04:06 AM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,803
Alan Belson Offline
Ireland is even wetter than England and Wales, and I noted from djk's post that a cavity is also installed between the masonry leaves. For additions you have to disc-cut/break through an access doorway and seal the cavity off with bricks/blocks and a damp membrane, then tie the new/old structures together. This is done by either keying the bricks in at the join ( interlocked and retains a cavity), or by bolting a vertical steel plate to the old abutting wall and using clip-in ties at each course ( new cavity, not connected). Getting bricks to match is a nightmare, as there are literally hundreds of facing-brick types/colors, and of course discontinued lines! Blockwork is easier, as the outer elevations will usually be cement rendered.
For re-modelling, yes it's a lot of mess & dust but folks do it, replastering over new/old masonry with mortar scratchcoats and finish plaster. This type of work is usually where two small rooms are knocked into one, with a steel joist inserted if the wall was load bearing. The wiring, as in Ireland, is usually chased into the wallwork, and you can even get a cutter which drills square holes for the boxes!


Wood work but can't!
Re: Wiring Location in Walls #143817 09/23/05 02:14 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 51
Mash Offline
The other way and most common way to be exempt from this rule is to have the cable RCD protected. My understanding is that it is not compulsory to have RCD protection but imposible to comply with the first said rule AS3000 s3.9.4.5 without it as you were correct the internal walls are too narrow and you cannot gaurantee where the cable you dropped down the wall will hang especially if its insulated.

Re: Wiring Location in Walls #143818 09/23/05 02:19 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 803
mxslick Offline

A tip of the hat and a large mug of finest to your sir, thanks for the great explanation!

A cutter that does square holes? Wow! Do you have a picture or link to that beast?


Stupid should be painful.
Re: Wiring Location in Walls #143819 09/23/05 07:20 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 186
aland Offline
A cutter that does square holes?

Would that be called a chasing chisel!
Only joking try I have one of these they are OK as long as the bricks are not too hard. Dusty old thing to use as well!Does a job though. Regards Aland

Re: Wiring Location in Walls #143820 09/24/05 03:42 AM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 8,277
Trumpy Offline
Welcome to the group Mash!. [Linked Image]
Using an RCD as a be all and end all to all of the problems associated with Electricity is wrong.
Good circuit design and installation come into it too.
Oh and BTW Alan, we use a Hyrdaulic cutter to cut out our 72 x 72mm or 96 x 96mm meters in our panels.

[This message has been edited by Trumpy (edited 09-24-2005).]

Re: Wiring Location in Walls #143821 09/26/05 05:24 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 51
Mash Offline
I could not agree more about correct installation and design. It would appear that the powers to be have set the rules up this way so that you have to install an RCD with any new wiring without actually coming out and saying " though shall install an RCD". A good idea as alot of consumers would not pay for the installation of an RCD if they didnt have to.

Re: Wiring Location in Walls #143822 09/28/05 08:21 PM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,250
djk Offline
If you want to see some Irish property prices:

Is a good place to start..

They can be pretty steep in Dublin in particular

(Some highlights)

Re: Wiring Location in Walls #143823 10/06/05 06:57 PM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 12
Spock Offline OP

RCD is one solution i guess, but not likely to occur, they cost money.


the section goes on to denote zones similar to that which you mention, although they don't have to be identified.

Wood stud walls are probably less of an issue, we sparky's in oz are a bit lazy when it comes to drilling in dirt and dust, and wood is usually only used in domestic residence with structural walls so dropping from the ceiling space is easier.

Commercial however uses a lot of non-structural seperating walls, these are framed out in tin with cabling penetrations. This makes it easier to run around the wall with only a feeder drop from ceiling space. As the holes are rarely aligned with each other, let alone electrical outlets, cables can be anywhere.

Thanks for the feedback anyway guys, guess i'll just have to make a ruling on site.


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