ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
ShoutChat Box
Recent Posts
Unusual Well Pump Switch Failure
by sabrown - 10/28/20 04:31 PM
Look at this mess...
by InspectorE - 10/27/20 09:09 PM
New tool
by gfretwell - 10/24/20 11:09 AM
Where is Everyone?
by Bill Addiss - 10/17/20 07:04 PM
New in the Gallery:
Facebook follies, bad wiring
FPE in Germany pt.2
Who's Online Now
1 registered members (Scott35), 18 guests, and 12 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Residential Service? #112120 04/06/01 08:25 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,631
Admin Offline OP
<img border="0" src=&q...uot;253" height="400">

Click Photo for a closer look

This was found in a Home that was purchased several years ago.

It was previously owned by an Electrical Engineer. This Home

had been inspected prior to purchase. In the years since the purchase

a Utility worker and an Electrician had also been in the panel and

not mentioned anything to the new owners.

What do you think?

Tools for Electricians:
Re: Residential Service? #112121 04/06/01 08:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,044
Tom Offline
You said all you needed to say when you mentioned the electrical engineer that owned this house. [Linked Image] No insult intended to the EE's participating on this message board.

If this is the service panel, where is the service disconnect?

If this is a sub panel, where is the equipment grounding conductor & its busbar?

There is a violation for 2 conductors in one lug at the feed eand (bottom). Using a 3 phase panel in this installation may be a listing violation and I would be concerned about multiwire branch circuits overloading the shared grounded conductor.

But the worst part is that this is an FPE panel. Visit for plenty of horror stories.


Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example.
Re: Residential Service? #112122 04/06/01 08:57 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,961
Bill Addiss Offline

There is no disconnect. What you see is all there is. This person quite obviously got a used 3 phase panel from somewhere and installed it at home. Notice only about 1/2 the breakers are used.

I mean nothing against the EE's either, but some don't realize that there's more to this type of work than the theory they were taught in school. [Linked Image]


Re: Residential Service? #112123 04/07/01 05:58 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 54
wayne Offline
For some reason or another it seems like the EE and some electricans beleive that it is OK just as long as it is their home. Howerever they fail to realized the potinal danger in their pruduent judement. Judging from what I see he or she had used a Used 3ph panel, which in not according to the code as well as no main, Egc. It really doesent supprise me to see this kind of thing. That guy proably was on the code making panel.

[This message has been edited by Webmaster (edited 04-07-2001).]

Re: Residential Service? #112124 04/07/01 06:10 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,961
Bill Addiss Offline

In case you're wondering, I removed the quote part from your post because having the photo twice in the post really slows down the page loading. [Linked Image]

My first clue that something was up was seeing all the breaker space used and only about 10 cables going in. What would you say to convince the Homeowner that this is something that should be taken care of?


Re: Residential Service? #112125 04/07/01 06:49 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,389
sparky Offline
"Sir, would you like to have this situation corrected?" [Linked Image]
"what do you mean, an EE installed it, it's been fine for years!" [Linked Image]
"well, you see, there is no main disconnect, the panel is 3 phase, and you are single phase, plus it's a federal pacific!"
homeowner;( eyeballing quote) [Linked Image]
"This place passed inspection when i bought it, and the power company AND an electrician have seen this and said nothing!" [Linked Image]
"well, obviously they simply did not concern themselves with the potential hazards here" [Linked Image]
homeowner ;( bald spot glowing bright red)
" well, i'm not going to concern myself with you, hit the bricks!!!" [Linked Image]

Re: Residential Service? #112126 04/07/01 06:54 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,961
Bill Addiss Offline

Your 'Panelside Manner' needs work! [Linked Image]

Re: Residential Service? #112127 04/08/01 09:23 AM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,389
sparky Offline
I'm workin' on it Boss!!!

[Linked Image]

Re: Residential Service? #112128 04/14/01 08:27 AM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,283
electure Offline
Are those wires sticking out of the front near the top unterminated grounds? I also see a single conductor (?) stapled down on the right side of the board. This panel must have been a "deal" from somebody who had demoed it ("that's right, I can give it to you for only $20"). They should have thrown it the dumpster where it belongs.

Re: Residential Service? #112129 04/14/01 08:59 AM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,961
Bill Addiss Offline

The wires sticking out are new circuits not yet connected to breakers. The wire on the right side is the #6 Alum to Waterpipe. I'm thinking that He probably got this from work, maybe out of the dumpster like you said. [Linked Image]


Page 1 of 2 1 2


2020 National Electrical Code
2020 National Electrical
Code (NEC)

* * * * * * *

2020 Master Electrician Exam Preparation Combos
2020 NEC Electrician
Exam Prep Combos:
Master / Journeyman


Member Spotlight
Nicholson Ga
Posts: 34
Joined: June 2006
Show All Member Profiles 
Top Posters(30 Days)
Popular Topics(Views)
271,034 Are you busy
205,039 Re: Forum
193,154 Need opinion
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3