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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 10
F
Junior Member
Yeah, I know about your tippy top secret little world where the security concerns border on paranoia. I worked jobs like that in the Pentagon. No inspectors, no permits, nobody to answer to. In spite of this, I felt it was just proper to do the job as close to the code as possible. I was a Federal employee, we did not charge those exorbitant rates to the customers. Now, however, as politics has mandated the contracting of private companies to do the work, we as taxpayers all have to pay the price. If you require top secret, agency approved electricians just so you don't have to have an escort to watch them, you are faced with this dilemma. Just pay the 5,000. It's not your money, and forget about it.
If dealing with Government stupidity bothers you, just quit, like I did, and get a real job.

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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,445
Likes: 2
Cat Servant
Member
Let's not get too far off topic here. It's just too easy to do ...

That Steve is an engineer doing electric work - well, that's a whole 'nother issue.
As is the very idea that the US military, with the tens of thousands of trained troops, can't produce a single electrician's mate to do this right ... well, who ever expects sense from the government?
Think of it as "Vigilante action." Steve gets to design, install, inspect, and approve his work. Sort of like being jugge, jury, and prosecutor laugh

Anyway ... I've tested, and examined lots of stuff of this sort in the past; some was even for a testing agency.
By far the main problems discovered had to do with strain relief and abrasion protection. That's why I suggested the heavy duty cord grips.

In a quirk of bureaucratic logic, UL will not list a power strip that can be easily, securely mounted. Their concern has to do with the fear that the circuit would then have too many receptacles (remember that 90 watt per recep thing in the load calcs?) Therefore, the strips can only be 'temporary' ... which in turn suggests NOT being able to bolt them in place.
I didn't say I agreed with this silliness; I'm just reporting it.

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,923
Likes: 32
G
Member
A PE is as qualified as an EM in this case. EMs are trained to do wiring on ships as a general rule. They are exempt from the NEC and use very much different systems.
Steve is just humoring us anyway. The Federal Government writes it's own rules, even out in "civvie land". I have worked in lots of government data centers where GSA does the wiring and they pretty much do what they want. They don't get permits and they self inspect. Things do move at "government speed". I had one customer who got frustrated with the plodding pace GSA set and contracted an outside electrician to get his system up. All hell broke loose but he eventually got away with it because it was rental space in a privately owned building so GSA really wasn't supposed to be doing the work in the first place. (although they regularly did).


Greg Fretwell
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,213
S
Member
Heh, I really didn't want to derail the thread with an attack on governmental oversight- I only brought it up to try to preemtively cut off the inevitible "JUST DO IT RIGHT!" comments. The security is always a hinderence and a pain, but it's there for a reason and we have no choice but to accept the cost. The contracting practices border on the absurd sometimes, but it's fundamentally no different than any other large company and designed to stop fraud and favortism.

I've never been active military, always been a civilian. My background is largely shipboard electronics engineering; I worked some shipboard power when it was incidental to my projects, but it was never my bread and butter. My present job is all about shoreside emergency power. NEC is the law, and though I could technically 90.4 whatever I want, that's not the right way to do it- I use strict accordance with NEC wherever possible. When other codes apply, like installs in France, Italy, Germany, Japan, etc- it's strict accordance with whichever code is more stringent. (Usually NEC is the more stringent.)

Quote
Think of it as "Vigilante action." Steve gets to design, install, inspect, and approve his work.
Don't forget "answer for" and, unfortunately, "fund"! If, say, the pacific fleet loses satellite communications because I ****ed something up, oh man there would be hell to pay! Redundancy, redundancy, redundancy- practically everything I do is hospital grade.

This particular job is nothing, a side-thought. It's not tactical, it's not terribly important, it's just moving some vending machines. Hell, $5k is nothing, either- it would actually be personally easier for me to submit the job through channels than do it myself, especially considering I'd be funding the material costs from my own pocket! I'm trying to do the right thing here. If I was allowed to, I'd lop the cord off the coke machine and hardwire it directly, but I don't think the coke guys would like that, and the cord's probably wouldn't quite reach. A surge supressor appeared to be an easy, if imperfect, solution.

So, anyhow, I knew hardwiring plugs is safe and common and we did it on ships as a matter of normal practice. I posted the question to this forum because most of us here live and breathe the code and love to play "stump the expert" for a hobby, and figured a few people could probably quote the code permitting or prohibiting off the top of their head! And, armed with that knowledge, I could proceed or come up another plan.

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 25
M
Member
steve, i guess another option you may want to look at is a product made by "wiremold". they make a strip that is intended to be hard wired. it has 1/2" ko's in the back, it comes in different lengths. i think a 5ft strip is about $45 at the big orange..... (fix up your office and sponcer my driver at the same time!)

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 174
K
Member
How about using a Woodhead pendant station?

I like the 34047 style on the bottom right of this page: http://www.woodhead.com/data/current3054/multitap%20902.pdf

or the style on the bottom right of this page: http://www.woodhead.com/data/current1486/GFCI%20Outlet%20boxes%20902.pdf

They are designed to be hardwired.

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 399
A
Member
Not to add to the problems you're dealing with but, if the receptacles are to supply vending machines you need to check section 422.51 of the 2005 NEC. This is a new section and requires ALL vending machines to be GFI protected.
ALAN--


Alan--
If it was easy, anyone could do it.
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,213
S
Member
Oh snap, didn't know that! Thanks for bringing it to my attention! Not that they're GFCI protected now, but that's an easy fix.

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