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A safety message by a Utility in nthe MidWest #88441
06/02/04 08:09 AM
06/02/04 08:09 AM
Joe Tedesco  Offline OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,749
Boston, Massachusetts USA
[Linked Image]


Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
Re: A safety message by a Utility in nthe MidWest #88442
06/02/04 02:47 PM
06/02/04 02:47 PM
F
Fred  Offline
Member
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 449
Straughn, IN 47387
Joe, What's your point?

Re: A safety message by a Utility in nthe MidWest #88443
06/02/04 07:48 PM
06/02/04 07:48 PM
Joe Tedesco  Offline OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,749
Boston, Massachusetts USA
The company Xcel Energy was kind enough to put this billboard up that sends a message of safety!

The message is clear, and will put some fear in the minds of those who may be considering painting their home like this person.

I have an actual video showing a painter who made contact with the service entrance conductors at the drip loop and fell off the ladder.



[This message has been edited by Joe Tedesco (edited 06-02-2004).]


Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
Re: A safety message by a Utility in nthe MidWest #88444
06/02/04 10:11 PM
06/02/04 10:11 PM
W
wa2ise  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 785
Oradell NJ USA
No problem at my house, the service entrance is underground. Comes into the basement immediately into the meter, and about 6 inches below the meter can is the service equipment. A pair of 100 amp fuses. Then that feeds a heavy BX style 3 wire #2 AWG cable that runs to a panel in the middle of the house.

Even though it's a subpanel, the ground bond screw connects the neutral to the grounding. I would guess that the BX shield would not take a 100 amp fault current, and would burn the house if it did. House was built in the 1950's.

Re: A safety message by a Utility in nthe MidWest #88445
06/03/04 10:40 AM
06/03/04 10:40 AM
M
Mean Gene  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 152
Ohio, USA
Quote
I have an actual video showing a painter who made contact with the service entrance conductors at the drip loop and fell off the ladder.


Joe, can you post a link to it here??

I can think of several people I would like to show that to. [Linked Image]

Re: A safety message by a Utility in nthe MidWest #88446
06/03/04 11:09 AM
06/03/04 11:09 AM
Joe Tedesco  Offline OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,749
Boston, Massachusetts USA
Mean Gene:

The story about the painter falling off the ladder is on a video purchased from Dupont in Virginia, I will see if I can do a short clip on my digital camera so it can be posted for you.

The name of the video is: "Take Electricity Seriously" and it is probably one of the best because they are not actors!

The stories are all true, and show how a person was electrocuted in his flooded basement, the guy touching the electrical vacuum cleaner while cleaning his car ... this video also shows a medic who made contact with HV lines.

wa2ise:

"the ground bond screw connects the neutral to the grounding"

Not good and you will hear from others here too, maybe they can add to this or you can see the commentary in the NECH in 408.20 and 21??


Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
Re: A safety message by a Utility in nthe MidWest #88447
06/03/04 04:40 PM
06/03/04 04:40 PM
R
Roger  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,716
N.C.
Joe, there was a roofer killed in Asheville five or six years ago when he came into contact with a service drop.

This was a commercial building and I don't recall the details so I can't remember the voltage, but in any case this warning would have saved him if he would have adhered to it.

Wa2ise, I would separate these conductors, and even though there may be some who would say the Armour may not clear a fault of 100 amps, (put a megger at 500 or 1000v between the points for a test) I would feel better about this than the possibility of the Armour carrying the neutral load.

Personally, I'd try to run an external EGC between the panels. (yea, yea, yea, I know [Linked Image]

Roger




[This message has been edited by Roger (edited 06-03-2004).]

Re: A safety message by a Utility in nthe MidWest #88448
06/06/04 08:52 PM
06/06/04 08:52 PM
Joe Tedesco  Offline OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,749
Boston, Massachusetts USA
Roger:

This rule allows the installation you described. It was used when there were no EGC's, so it may not be acceptable.

For you though, Yes, Yes, Yes! Do it!

250.134(B) With Circuit Conductors. By an equipment grounding conductor contained within the same raceway, cable, or otherwise run with the circuit conductors.


Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant

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