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#71270 - 10/24/06 03:26 PM Red Tags you didn't agree about?  
Trick440  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 248
Waterford, MI, USA
What are some offense you have been red tagged for that in your mind where questionable?

We have been red tagged for cold water clamps not being stamped with UL. These are clamps the supply house sells and have been used all over.

Got one the other day for not having a plug over the laundry room countertop.

I have also recieved a tag for NOT bonding the gas line... and then another inspecter complaining, because we bonded the gas line. As a side note I would not bond a gas line, but we work all over and we bond it just to try and eliminate problems.

So any questionable red taG stories?


Shake n Bake

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#71271 - 10/24/06 03:39 PM Re: Red Tags you didn't agree about?  
trekkie76  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 220
baileyville, maine, usa
had one last week. The service on a new bank came underground, entered the foundation(4 1/2 ft crawlspace) went 2ft into a 90, up into an interior wall, terminating in the panel. probably 8 ft total service enterance conductors in the building. Got a red tag for not having a disconnect where the enterance entered the building.
I argued that the panel location was the first readily accessible location for the disconnect, as the crawlspace enterance was a 3 ft square hole in the floor with no permenant stairs. The inspector said the disconnect should have gone ourside then.
we dug up the underground, swung it over 10 ft to bring it up into a disconnect, but the bank owner wanted inside.
So, final result: disconnect is inside, underground l-b's into back of it, SER to panel. What a circus! Glad I didn't have much to do with it, except after all the debate was done!!


#71272 - 10/24/06 05:27 PM Re: Red Tags you didn't agree about?  
steve ancient apprentice  Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 169
west springfield,mass
As for red tag on the gas main here in mass it is strickley forbidden. Under no circumstances are we to clamp the gas . One red tag that i never knew about was in residential work. Most all of us have stapled useing the standard blue staples with 2 romexs underneath it. Low and behold they make a staple strickley for this purpose. I never knew about it. Has anyone else run accross this?I would like to know.


#71273 - 10/24/06 10:21 PM Re: Red Tags you didn't agree about?  
Rewired  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 558
Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Ahh the infamous Gas line bond!
That was a recent change in code here I think within the last 10 years and we are now required to do it. Only problem is recently we have had an inspector going around checking rental properties in the city and he is making us bond all gas lines in the older units, among other things that were code compliant some years ago but "aren't" now.And 2 romex under one staple.. Forbidden here for years. Surprised the inspector in this area with the "fine tooth comb" hasn't made us change that in the older buildings either.

A.D


#71274 - 10/25/06 09:52 AM Re: Red Tags you didn't agree about?  
Zapped  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 482
Huntington Beach, CA, USA
On a new designer-residential home build, where the walls were all core-10 steel (yes, very odd) I ran EMT down the walls from a drywalled-in joist-bay lid for a couple of the switches and outlets on some of the exposed-block internal walls. I had the romex from within the lid going into the EMT (with proper fittings and clamp connectors), leaving the exposed portion of the run in 3/4" EMT down to the surface mounted switch & outlet boxes.

The inspector tagged me on it, saying you can't run romex in EMT. I actually went down to the city with my NEC and Illustrated NEC and tried to show him the Chapter 9 Note 9, which specifically provides fill provisions for running multi-conductor cable through conduit, and he wouldn't even look down at the book. He just looked at me and told me NO. Wouldn't listen to a word I had to say. It was clearly an ego thing, and there was nothing I could do about it.

I had to put a junction box in the lid near the EMT, run flex to the EMT, and then pull in single conductor THHN into the switches and outlets.

I'm still wondering what that was all about. The very same guy had nothing but great things to say about my EMT and panel work, but it sure seemed personal at the time.


#71275 - 10/25/06 12:14 PM Re: Red Tags you didn't agree about?  
macmikeman  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 717
Honolulu, Hawaii
Last year I got tagged for a panel that was 4 feet from a laundry tray. Same guy another house gave me one for connecting a gec to a rebar in the slab. (I used a listed connector for this by the way and the conductor was 4 solid cu). He had never seen such a thing and just knew it was a code violation. I could go on all day, but I am sure I have been let off the hook for real things I did wrong many many more times than these few irritations so I have learned to just smile about it .


#71276 - 10/25/06 01:13 PM Re: Red Tags you didn't agree about?  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,099
Estero,Fl,usa
Any inspector who is not willing to explain the violation and use NEC references should be fired. I have changed my mind on the spot if the electrician can make a good "code" case. I usually preferred to ask why something was done a certain way instead of starting out with saying it was wrong. Of course there are slam dunks but usually the EC will respond with "Oh Spit" when I pointed them out. I never liked the idea that this was a "them vs us" relationship.
We should both be working to assure a safe installation.


Greg Fretwell

#71277 - 10/25/06 08:40 PM Re: Red Tags you didn't agree about?  
BigB  Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 719
Tucson, AZ USA
No hold down device on a back fed breaker on a listed assembly, specifically Cutler Hammer 100 amp meter combos that come with a backfed 100 amp main breaker. In addition to the assembly being listed that way, 384-16 says this requirement is for field installed conductors, which the ones in the assembled panel are not. Still, one inspector requires us to add the hold down kit.


#71278 - 10/26/06 07:13 AM Re: Red Tags you didn't agree about?  
Eddy Current  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 111
Ontario,Canada
Inspectors are like hockey refs. Once they make a desision you won`t change their mind. And if you complain too much, you`ll get more time in the box!
I do demand a code reference for any defect I get and challenge any I don`t agree with.


#71279 - 10/26/06 12:38 PM Re: Red Tags you didn't agree about?  
mikesh  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 613
Victoria, BC, Canada
I am an inspector and a Bicycle Racing referee and when shown evidence to the contrary I must consider it. Any Inspector who brings their ego to work should probably find another line of work. BUT there are plenty of contractors who display this same behaviour too. I have had contractors refuse to make a correction even after agreeing the call is right because they have been doing it that way for years. I also have dealt with the inspector that refuses to change a call regardless of the evidence he has made a mistake. On one occasion I refused to make his correction and started an appeal. I won and thank God he retired within a couple of years cause he would have become My current boss. Ya, I would never have gotten the job. I probably did get the job because I was crazy enough to challenge his call and make it stick.



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