ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
Top Posters(30 Days)
Potseal 11
sparky 5
Recent Posts
Permit Snafus...AHJs and Contractors Jump in
by sparky. 04/29/17 05:59 PM
201 volt equipment?
by bigpapa. 04/29/17 12:15 AM
Schneider LC1D09
by jraef. 04/28/17 11:05 PM
Electrode boilers question
by annemarie1. 04/27/17 01:40 PM
Why cables look like they do
by LongRunner. 04/26/17 09:36 AM
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
Popular Topics(Views)
234,966 Are you busy
169,800 Re: Forum
163,011 Need opinion
Who's Online Now
1 registered members (NORCAL), 67 guests, and 8 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#112156 - 04/17/01 09:35 AM Threadbare SE Cable - What are the Dangers?  
Admin  Offline

Administrator
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,439
NY, USA
<img border="0" src=&q...uot;297" height="400">


Click Photo for Larger Image


What would say the issues and/or dangers here are?

Bill


Tools for Electricians:

#112157 - 04/17/01 10:17 AM Re: Threadbare SE Cable - What are the Dangers?  
sparky66wv  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,236
West Virginia
I find this problem a lot and would appreciate some ammo for my arguments to replace such worn SE cable.

The "general public" consensus seems to be:

"Oh, it's just a ground wire..."

The local fire department had such an SE cable that had corroded to the point that only a few strands of the neutral were still connected. Ironic isn't it?

My guess is that corrosion is allowed to progress with the help of oxidation and UV light; eventualy to the point of a failed neutral before anyone does anything about it. (Then, of course, it's too late for some appliances..."why didn't you warn me?" they'll say...hmmmmm.)


-Virgil
Residential/Commercial Inspector
5 Star Inspections
Member IAEI

#112158 - 04/17/01 05:13 PM Re: Threadbare SE Cable - What are the Dangers?  
Tom  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,044
Shinnston, WV USA
The biggest problem I've had with cables like this is that they are no longer raintight. Water wicks down the cable & frequently starts the lugs in the meter corroding. I've also seen it continue past the meter & go down the cable to the service disconnect in the basement & rot out the lugs there.

If you need a code citation, try 300-12

Tom


Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example.

#112159 - 04/17/01 06:05 PM Re: Threadbare SE Cable - What are the Dangers?  
Bill Addiss  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,878
NY, USA
What about possible shock hazards?

Bill


#112160 - 04/17/01 06:39 PM Re: Threadbare SE Cable - What are the Dangers?  
sparky66wv  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,236
West Virginia
Yeah, I've seen lots of discos with rotting CB's even with the SE intact and the proper raintite connector used... This is of course when the disco is directly below the MB. I can easily see where this would aggravate the existing sealing problems.

Good Q Bill, what about the shock hazards?...
It's grounded but carrying lots of current...


-Virgil
Residential/Commercial Inspector
5 Star Inspections
Member IAEI

#112161 - 04/17/01 06:54 PM Re: Threadbare SE Cable - What are the Dangers?  
sparky  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,308
these are everywhere ! the only thing missing is the semi-bare conductors out of the head, and the arc-welds from clacking together in the wind.

must be why that 'sunlight resistant' code was made [ 310-8(d)]

i point this sort of disaster-in-progress out when on service calls, etc. i usually ask them to ask any local sparky for a 2nd opinion.
[Linked Image]


#112162 - 04/17/01 07:32 PM Re: Threadbare SE Cable - What are the Dangers?  
Bill Addiss  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,878
NY, USA
As Tom pointed out, from what I see, one result of this condition is the entrance of water into the Meterpan which drips on the central Neutral lug an eventually rusts it away. If Panelboard is in Basement it gets water in it possibly damaging the Bus and/or Main Breaker.

To most this would seem to be a shock or fire hazard ... is it?

Bill


#112163 - 04/20/01 10:13 AM Re: Threadbare SE Cable - What are the Dangers?  
sparky66wv  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,236
West Virginia
I would imagine fire would be the biggest concern if the neutral lug (or other connection of the neutral) allowed the infamous 240V series to smoke a few appliances.

Ground reference may be lost in places with poor soil, and poor grounding.

Someone in a panic to unplug said smoking appliances could be hurt by burn or electrocution.

Just MHO...

Any additional comments?

-Virgil ('66)


-Virgil
Residential/Commercial Inspector
5 Star Inspections
Member IAEI

#112164 - 04/20/01 03:59 PM Re: Threadbare SE Cable - What are the Dangers?  
wayne  Offline
Member
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 54
NC
Its obvious that this service was installed a long time ago. And yes as the person that did the remodeling, siding, facier board trim. They most likely did not resecure the entrance cable.

This however is a serious problem. Not to mention Shock, as well as damaging equiment ect.

I think they should have some sort of inspection from time to time, especially in the older sections. I know that the inspection Department know that this type of thing is going on. They condem building for safty reasons ect.

I beleive a lot of the problems we have exisiting today is because of lack of concern.

Wayne,


#112165 - 05/12/01 09:36 AM Re: Threadbare SE Cable - What are the Dangers?  
cinkerf  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 84
Pittsburgh, Pennsysvania. ...
Can someone explain the shock hazard to me. I don't doubt that there is one. I just don't understand the theory behind it. The grounded neutral is also bonded to the ground rod which is driven in the earth. Wouldn't it be the same as a person touching the bare #6 awg grounding electrode conductor which is installed from the service panelboard to the ground rod? There is no shock hazard with that example.

Frank (cinkerf)


Page 1 of 2 1 2

Member Spotlight
The_Lightman
The_Lightman
Orlando, Fl, USA
Posts: 49
Joined: August 2001
Show All Member Profiles 
Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Shout Box
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.015s Queries: 15 (0.003s) Memory: 0.8196 MB (Peak: 0.9998 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2017-04-30 05:03:23 UTC