ECN Forum Forums General Topics of the Trade General Discussion Area Ebay

Ebay is a pirates' paradise.

Curiosity got the better of me, and I went looking there for pipe bending equipment.
I found a lot of incomplete gear there. I found minimal descriptions....what you saw in the pic was apparrently what you got. If you failed to notice that a few critical smaller parts were absent- well, too bad.
One piece pictured was a Harbor Freight "pipe bender," of extremely limited use. The description failed to mention the make of the item....but a search under "greenlee benders" got it to pop up.
Pricing, for the complete sets, was often higher than retail.

When I see lots of "new" stuff...say, five 1/2" benders, with an asking price less than the cost of one.... I can't help but be suspicious. Ditto with odd assortments of tools. And, when a $2000 tool is listed at $150, the word "Theft" screams out at me.

You know neither the seller nor his source. Some of these sharpies take "let the buyer beware" to an extreme. To believe that someone, out of the generosity of their hearts, is willing to provide you with such great bargains defies belief.

Pawn brokers have always been associated with stolen goods- so some regulations were placed upon them. Ebay, and other "auction" houses, have no such constraints.

Finally, there is the nature of auctions themselves. Apart from "auction fever," there are various scams that use the auction as a means to fleece you. These include the seller bidding on his own stuff (often through a "shill," or partner), excessive handling fees, counterfeit goods, and targeting you for future "special offers."

I'm not about to give a thief a market. Sure, I've had folks consider me the 'village idiot' for this attitude, but I don't care. Someone else may buy it- but not me!

Remember, anybody can claim anything on the internet. A fancy web site may easily originate in the trunck of a car in a bar parking lot. There is no reason to expect an "auction house" to care about the source of the goods sold- any more than the local flea market.

The next time someone brags about their "great deals"....look in their tool box. If every tool has a different name engraved on it, you can be sure that there are some victims out there.

If I am ranting a little much, consider this: Until recently, the other half of my duplex was a dope den. Almost across the street from me, there was a "sell your stuff on the internet" business. I saw every doper in town going in there, selling items they had 'scavenged.' When we finally closed down the dope house, it wasn't long before the "business" moved on as well!

"For evil to triumph, good men need do nothing."

If you are the seller sometimes that last minute of the auction impulse to need an item will make people not realize that they just paid more for a used itme than a brand new one and you end up with more than you ever thought you would get.
One example I can offer is an aquarium I had laying aroudn the house that I decided to try and sell on Ebay.
I hoped to get about $80 for it, I listed it for $80 and next thing I know it ended at $167.50.
The next day the guy calls me and says his truck broke down and would not be able to pick it up until he got his truck fixed, then asked if it was ok if he paid for it.
I say sure that would be great and he comes by and pays for it.
This was about 2 weeks ago and I have not heard from this guy after several times trying to contact him.
I now have an old aquarium sitting in my basement that some guy paid for and has not picked it up.
Some people just get fired up at the last few minutes of the auction and have to have the item.
As a buyer it is definitely good to set a cap on what you are willing to pay, and once the price goes higher let the impulse buyers have their way.

Reno, I understand what you are saying but not all good deals are stolen merchandise. That link I gave you in chat the other night is one of them. I checked them out, they are a large publicly traded company with their main office located in the Netherlands.

reno wrote:


In some cases, yeah I would tend to agree.

However, a lot of what I buy on eBay (AMX control system components) goes for pennies on the dollar simply because it was removed during an upgrade or demolition and is not needed. A few of the sellers let it go cheap because they're not aware of it's real value, and others simply because to them it's clutter or dead inventory.

And I frequently get old cinema equipment (or new equipment not needed) (Power amps, lenses, projector parts, etc.) that I sell with a very low reserve {meaning a minimum price I'll accept for the item to actually sell} or no reserve at all. I have almost always been surprised to get a lot more than I thought I would.

I do agree that tools, especially things like benders, sawzalls, and so on which are high theft items, should be apporached with caution. But what about an older EC who's retiring from the trade and is willing to part with the tools at any price? Kinda like an international yard sale deal. After years of use, probably not expecting (or caring to) get top dollar.

A look at the seller's feedback rating (anything below 95% would be suspect in my book) and reviewing the negatives given on one's rating {to see any seller's feedback comments, simply click on the feedback rating #} should tell a lot about their honesty. Some negatives are a result of shipping delays or simple miscommunications, not necessarily a bad transaction. A feedback comment, once it is left, cannot be changed or reversed {except in extremely rare cases by eBay admin} so a single hothead can trash an otherwise reputable seller's rating.

The best rules for dealing on eBay have been mentioned here already, but to summarize:

1: Check out the seller's ratings before you bid;
2: Read the entire listing before bidding, if it's incomplete or vague, bid with caution;
3: Ask questions! Virtually all listings have a link to ask the seller questions. If you're really interested in the item, use it. If the reply isn't satisfactory (or you get no reply) then don't bid.
4: Don't make your maximum bid more that you're willing to pay for the item. If some bozo is willing to outbid you and pay too much, bully for them!
5: For an item you really want, wait until the last hour or so of the auction before you start bidding, you can sometimes get a better deal that way.;
6: If you're bidding on multiple items from the same seller, don't be afraid to ask for combined shipping if you're the winner, it can save a lot of money and most honest sellers will oblige. (The exception would be on heavy items where the total package weight would be over about 50-60lbs. The overweight charges would eat up any savings.); and
7: Finally, Caveat emptor. ["Let the buyer beware"} Use common sense and you can have fun and save a lot on any auction site.

And if you have any old inventory, tools, etc that you want to get rid of, consider listing them yourself. You may be pleasantly surprised!

edited to add:

Hotline1 wrote:


Go for it!! The ebay Motors section specializes in that sort of thing!

[This message has been edited by mxslick (edited 10-09-2005).]

First, I sell at Ebay and I am not a pirate. Common sense goes a long way with Ebay. If I was looking at any of the adds that you saw, I would have simply passed them up. Incomplete gear or minimal descriptions means, go to the next auction. If you viewed Ebay as a billion garage sales going on at once, you would do better. Every garage holds a different seller. The majority are good people (like myself) who can easily be identified with the Feedback rating that every seller has listed right next to thier name. Just simple math. If I find a seller with 99.9 or 100% positive feedback at 2000+ feedbacks, I know I am looking at an honest seller and that they will do whatever they can to rectify any misunderstandings etc. should they occur. They NEED to protect that perfect feedback or the sales will begin to stop. I had to laugh at that one because after 5 years I continually sell my goods for about 1/5th their original cost, they are not stolen and they are goods that have never been used. I have repeat buyers that know me (the seller) and my source. --- And, my wife does think I'm too generous as a matter of fact. I guess you have to read the Ebay site rules. I have seen and read about many sellers being banned forever for illegal stuff. Remember again, these people never had many feedbacks to begin with (dead givaway. Again - feedbacks would refect this activity and the sellers true intent.


[This message has been edited by sponge (edited 10-09-2005).]

E-bay has it's advantages and disadvantages as everyone has pointed out thus far.

I tend to look at feedback and what the Negatives say about the person. People tend to just repeat themselves when everything is fine and dandy, but the negs. tell a different story.

This website has helped me in many a buy on E-bay: http://www.toolhaus.org/cgi-bin/negs

Just follow the directions and it will show only negs and neutrals. Pretty handy thing when dealing with new sellers.

I myself have had some great experiences with Ebay and not many bad ones

as to Ebay being a "pirates paradise" well, in my school we are required to have a Ti-83+ graphing calculator, retaling from from 75-100$, you can get one in perfect condition on ebay for 35-50$, well soon enough these calculators started getting stolen frequently and sold on Ebay, at least 2-3 dozen were stolen last year, some from people who's family's simply could not afford to buy such a high price item twice, and I imagine this could happen just as easily at a jobsite, someone buys a brand new Hole Hawg, Sawzall, Fluke, next day it's up for auction

I'm with Reno on this one. I have nothing but disdain for Ebay.

A few years ago I did photography on the side. That was before the photographic digital revolution made every pimply faced kid with a digital camera and a computer with Photoshop a "wedding photographer", but I digress...

I've been a member of a photography forum for many years. As you can imagine Ebay is a popular place for photographic equipment, especially it seems for the unscrupulous to sell to the naive.

Many times there were forum members who had equipment that had problems and rather than pay to have it fixed decided to sell it on Ebay and use the money to buy a new one. Usually their way of thinking was that they weren't going to disclose the problem so they can get the most money.

On the other hand there were buyers who never got the merchandise after paying for it, got something broken with the seller blaming it on UPS, even got a box with a brick in it, I could go on. Most often the buyer got something that had an intermittant problem that didn't show up for a month or two or didn't notice that some function didn't work until months after receiving it. Just what the seller was counting on.

Now, I'm sure that there are a majority of honest sellers as well as ligitimate deals on Ebay, but the very concept of it's operation makes it easy for those who would be dishonest to conduct business.

Like gambling, if you can't afford to lose what you spent you shouldn't be there.

-Hal

I mostly use Ebay for used computer parts although comp.sys.ibm.ps2.hardware is also a pretty good place to find old parts if you are a regular.
I also use Ebay for collectable type stuff.

I doubt there is much in the way of stolen stuff there.

I agree, finding a <insert big expensive tool>, missing the parts you keep in the cab of your truck, is probably stolen.

I've sold around 50 items on eBay and have purchased over 200 items on eBay. I have a 100% feedback rating combined for both. I have been happy with all my transactions. My worst experience was an item that took a little too long to arrive (2 weeks), but that is extremely rare. Most items get to me within a week and in good shape. I buy all power tools and some electrical supplies on eBay. Some things that may make my experiences better than others:

-I only buy new items, no used or reconditioned.
-The seller needs to have an almost perfect feedback rating, if they have any negatives, I read to see what the negatives were for.
-Read the item description and pictures more than once, if the description is incomplete or if they don't have photos, I don't bid.
-If they don't take PayPal for payment, I won't buy from them. I want to pay for the auction immediately after winning online, I don't want to have to go buy a money order or cashiers check. Also PayPal gives you some protection as a buyer.
-I usually buy items that are "Buy It Now" or I stalk the auction and bid in the last minute(not hour, minute) otherwise you'll be outbid unless you bid too much.
-If it's too good to be true, it probably is.


[This message has been edited by Electric Eagle (edited 10-09-2005).]