My POCO uses a locking meter ring and refuses to give out tools to local electricians. Any help in identifying the locking means and obtaining a tool would be appreciated. I could email a picture of the lock to anybody that experience with this. Most of the time it isn't a problem, but there have been times (late night service calls)when I would have been a lot more comfortable if I could have pulled the meter.

I spoke to our local fire cheif and the fire dept is not privy to the unlocking tools as well, isn't this a safety issue? Shouldn't they be able to yank the meter as a means of disconnect?

Come on, HG, you've been in the trade long enough to know better!

Pulling a meter does not always disconnect the service.
Nor is pulling the meter considered the required "disconnecting means."

More to the point, mere posession of the security tools, as well as replacement seals, can very easily -on the whim of the PoCo alone- become a crime. "Posession of burglary tools" is one such charge that may be charged.

Utilities have some of the atributes of governments; it's their meter; and they have the right to control access to it.

I do see his point. How do you replace a defective main breaker without pulling the meter? I suppose you can do it hot ... if you are brave.

Reno's point about handling the "keys" to the meter and most POCO's is about right of access to equipment. POCO meter, on customer owned equipment. Most are good enough to come out and remove it when you ask. Although you may be waiting for several days... Years ago, I realized I could get quicker service on this by skipping a few beurocratic channels, and got the dispatch number, and I usually get someone by in 1-2 hours. Often the reason I would need to get one off, is a "High/Low voltage issue" which usually gets them out quick. I am also not opposed to cutting a service at a head, or underground if it can be done safely...

I had to show a POCO guy a couple months ago how to use the key . I will try and find a link to one.

I fully appreciate Reno's response and understand the legality issues.
Most of the time I can get the power company out in a resonable amount of time. Just before I made the post I was trying to get them to come out after hours. I had a call to a home where the owner had a main that was tripped and had the handle broken off.
The lineman who returned my call told me, "Do it hot, that's the way we do it." He refused to come until the next day.
Of course I know pulling the meter doesn't always disconnect the power.
My intent is not to steal power or destroy equipment. I have a hacksaw, but I don't intend to cut the lock off someones tool chest with it, and steal their stuff.
Anyway..........thought a little more background was in order.

yes call, the dispatch number, When we get these jobs, we understand it may take hours for the utility to show up, so if it is an overhead service, then just disconnect at the head, if it is underground, wait for the utility to remove meter, we just bill the customer for waiting time.

Getting caught attempting to, or succeeding in removal of ANY security devices on utility metering equipment within the State of New Jersey is considered 'theft of services' and can result in $5000 fine and/or 60 days in jail. (BPU/NJ)

I have seen a few enterprising 'sparkies' use vise grips, an awl with a bent tip, a hammer, and the best was a hole saw. Within some neighborheeds, I've seen four (4) barrel locks with what looked like 10 lbs of brass plated steel on a CT cabinet. PSE&G has the biggest varity of security locks.

BTW: PSE&G has 24 hr trouble men; yes you may have to wait....but they do come!

John

HG, they use those here for people who don't pay their bill. Once you have a non payment history, the lock stays. I usually just cut them off with a 4 inch grinder. Next one I get I think I will disassemble it and see if I can't make a key.

Locks? What are those? In my town (pop 327) they only use rings for keeping the meter from falling out. I haven't seen any locks on anyone's service here...

Now, in Las Vegas, that was a different matter...

BigB, I appreciate your cleverness- just don't be TOO clever.

It's not your ring; damaging it is a crime.
It's not your lock; making a key is also illegal.

Think you can get away with it? Think you have some clever arguments? Maybe you do- but that's where lawyers make their money.

Owning a pair of Kleins does not mean you have an unfettered right to do as you please with anything electrical.

More importantly, electricians have to work with the PoCo on a regular basis. Do you want them to see you as a partner- or a nuisance? Call the troubleman, pay the service call, do it right.

AND- if some silly ape says "do it hot- we do it all the time"... I'm sure his boss would love to hear about that the next day.

In this area cutting a basic ring off is no big deal.

Mess with the barrel locks or other 'high security' devices and you will very likely be talking to the police.

The stance here seems to be much the same as John (Hotline) describes.

Bob

Here the POCO has two responses, if you can wait, they'll get out and take it off for you.

If you can't, and you call them in advance or at least call them and tell them, they'll tell you to cut it off with a grinder.

Most of the POCO guys admit they don't even have keys, they keep losing them...

Reno has a great point, make friends with them, it goes a long way....


Dnk...

If somebody calls us in advance, we'll get by and unlock it before they get there. If you call after hours, we charge to come unlock it.
No big deal around here.

On the other hand, theft of service is a third degree felony in Texas. It's a whole lot safer to wait til we get there.

For years, the electricians pulled meters and the POCO looked the other way. Now, because of safety issues, they are much more willing to come pull the meter. There are many services here with no main breaker ahead of the service so there is no other to de-energize except to pull the meter. But even the fire departments will no longer do it because it is just too dangerous. Run the numbers -it isn't worth it.

I don't see many locks in my area anymore, once PECO went with digital meters. Any time that I need to take out the meter, with a lock, I have the HO call PECO and have them remove the lock. In the city it takes a couple of days, In the suburbs, usually right away. In an emergency situation though, it kind of stinks.

I'm with the "make friends with the POCO" stance. When I worked in Southern CA, I tried to get a cell # for the troubleman or meter guy that would come out when I needed a meter yanked (usually for service changeouts) Those numbers saved me ALOT of time over the years when I needed something unlocked or disconnected. (They've even left me seals before and told me just throw a standard ring on and seal when I'm done )

Thankfully the company I work for now does sub out work for PG&E on occasions so we have legal access to meter keys and seals when necessary

As far as safety issues, PPE and technique has alot to do with that. Our uniforms are flame resistant (NFPA 70E, and OSHA final rule 1910.269), 5KV hot gloves, and a face shield are part of our issued "hot work" attire.

highground,
Over here at the PoCo that I work for, saying something like that over the phone to anyone would be in serious breach of our Health and Safety policy.
Should the person have an accident while disconnecting, the PoCo would then be liable for any injuries or damage.
My cell# is universally known around here amongst all the Electricians and I'm more than happy to go out and disconnect whatever is required, day or night.

I am a subcontractor for the electric company. Because they are not licensed their authority ends at the meter. The meter base is owned by the customers, but they have no access to the meter legally. I have encountered these locks and have been told to cut them and replace with a new meter ring and seal which I am supplied with. Before I worked with them and encountered a problem ,and had to gain access to the meter base I made sure to call them first and explain who I was and why I was cutting their seal. They had no problem with this as I had identified myself. They do take unauthorized entry to their meters very seriously, and I would not want to get on their bad side.

I was surprised when my parents experienced a loose hot wire which I traced to the meter socket. I called a friend of mine who is a lineman for the poco and asked if he would come help (after hours and off duty). He cut the seal, tightened the lug, and retorqued the rest and left the meter unsealed. Said that it didn't matter, the poco would figure it out eventually and replace it.

The seal was replaced shortly after and never any questions raised as to why it was removed and this poco is multi-state and a stickler on their service requirements.

Around here, it seems once the Contractor Work Request is OK'd by the POCO, they really don't care if you cut the ring and/or lock. In fact, it seems they'd rather you cut ring and/or lock to save them the "trouble" of a truck roll. And if you don't take things in your own hands, and instead wait for the POCO to unlock the meter you'll never get any jobs done.

Around here it's like Dnkldorf describes... and if they "ignore" your request to remove the lock, that's pretty much a license to get the grinder out.

After the job is done, an inspector from the POCO comes out. If all is OK, the POCO inspector schedules the installation of the metering and locks. Then the building department does the final "code" inspection.

At one of my friend's shop, he has a whole bin full or meter rings and CT locks... almost as if he were showing off scalps!

Joe

Where I used to work in Ohio, the Poco sealed with wire seals, clipping these for service work was no big deal. You would call and report and they would reseal.
Now where I am in the boonies of New Mexico the Poco is a small Coop that services a huge area with a crew of about 4 guys. There is no dispatch to call, the emergency number rings the one guy that is on call at his home. They would have my head if I ground off one of the locks. The customer service is terrible, that's why I started this thread, Just looking for alternatives for those infrequent emergencies.

Having said that, there is no real need to break PoCo seals here.
I can disconnect a house from the road pillar box or pole if it is required.
It saves having to encounter Pit-Bull dogs.
Or worse, Rottwielers.

Around here locks go on people that have a bad payment record. They also have these plastic inserts that go on the meter socket tabs to block the flow of electricity.

No one said a metal cutting saw yet. That's my key. Worked in every lock so far. I also herd of the saws-all blades with the carbide grit cutting locks.

The customer owns the meter socket here and the utility has nothing to say about opening it. OK. Maybe they will say who opened this. Ya tell em I did. Oh, OK.

Things are a bit differnt around here. Differnt strokes for differnt fokes. It takes different strokes to move the word.

Somewhere once I read that it is very dangerous to pull a meter especially if it is under a load. Hopefully, the EC is smart enough to knock the load off before they yank the meter.