ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
Top Posters(30 Days)
Potseal 11
Recent Posts
Why cables look like they do
by LongRunner. 04/26/17 09:36 AM
Dimmable LED 2x4 lay in fixtures
by HotLine1. 04/24/17 05:43 PM
Old decora style outlets
by Lostazhell. 04/22/17 07:59 PM
Permit Snafus...AHJs and Contractors Jump in
by gfretwell. 04/22/17 01:11 PM
How do you find a good employee?
by HotLine1. 04/22/17 10:44 AM
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
Popular Topics(Views)
234,765 Are you busy
169,519 Re: Forum
162,801 Need opinion
Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 46 guests, and 7 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
#99309 - 03/13/05 10:35 PM Supplemental Electrode Needed?  
shortcircuit  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 608
massachusetts
If the metal frame of a building is bonded to the metal water pipe as allowed in 250.52(A)(2) method #2, then the metal frame is allowed to be the supplemental electrode as allowed by 250.53(D)(2)

With this scenario though, when the metal water pipe is replaced with plastic down the road, the electrode system is lost altogether.

We need to supplement this scenario with a additional electrode such as ground rods because the metal frame of the building will no longer be effectively grounded when the metal water pipe is replaced with non-metalic pipe.

shortcircuit


2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides

#99310 - 04/01/05 03:02 PM Re: Supplemental Electrode Needed?  
earlydean  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 751
Griswold, CT, USA
250.52(A)(1) requires the metal underground water pipe to be in contact with the earth for 10 feet or more. As soon as you replace this pipe with non-metallic pipe, you have changed the grounding electrode system, and the GES must then be re-evaluated to meet current code. You don't get a free ride by going in through the back door.
This is why ALL work must have a permit applied for, so the inspector may determine if code compliance is achieved.


Earl

#99311 - 04/21/05 05:35 PM Re: Supplemental Electrode Needed?  
Dnkldorf  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,064
nowhere usa
earlydean, let's clarify your post.

250.52(A)(1) states that IF a metal water pipe IS to be used as a grounding electrode, it must be in contact with the earth for 10 feet or more.

250.52 doesn't state that a water pipe MUST be used as an grounding electrode.

EX. well water systems, plastic pipe incoming water.

However, if it is used as a grounding electrode and meets the earth contact requirement,it MUST be supplemented.

Does anyone else read it this way, or is it just me?

Dnk...


#99312 - 04/21/05 07:53 PM Re: Supplemental Electrode Needed?  
clearyjr  Offline
Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 3
new windsor, NY USA
250.53(D)(2) Supplemental electrode required. Generally we look for 25 ohms or less of earth ground with one rod and water main, so if this is not achived then we install another rod etc.....
So metal water main or not 25ohms or better should be the rule.



Member Spotlight
Attic Rat
Attic Rat
Bergen Co.,N.J. USA
Posts: 524
Joined: December 2003
Show All Member Profiles 
Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Shout Box
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.013s Queries: 15 (0.003s) Memory: 0.7601 MB (Peak: 0.8927 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2017-04-27 03:05:36 UTC