ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
Top Posters(30 Days)
Potseal 11
Recent Posts
600 KW 120/208 3 Phase Y protection
by SteveFehr. 07/23/17 09:46 AM
1913 American Electrician's Handbook
by gfretwell. 07/20/17 01:08 PM
Green House wiring
by ghost307. 07/20/17 09:10 AM
Permit Snafus...AHJs and Contractors Jump in
by HotLine1. 07/18/17 08:06 PM
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
Popular Topics(Views)
239,276 Are you busy
174,738 Re: Forum
167,113 Need opinion
Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 69 guests, and 9 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
#91507 - 01/20/05 10:47 AM Panel in basement  
George Little  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,489
Michigan USA
Is it necessary to install the Service panel on a board when installing it on the poured walls in the basement. Or can the contractor just "shoot" on the wall with a power actuated pin setter?


George Little

2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides

#91508 - 01/20/05 11:21 AM Re: Panel in basement  
jdadamo  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 37
Calgary, AB, Canada
Putting it on a board would make it much easier to fasten romex/conduit/whatever near the panel. Especially if its romex... good luck getting romex staples into concrete.


#91509 - 01/20/05 01:52 PM Re: Panel in basement  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,099
Estero,Fl,usa
I believe there has to be a 1/4" air space behind a metal cabinet attached directly to concrete that can accumulate moisture.
The wood relieves the installer of that.
If I get a minute I will dig up the specifics.


Greg Fretwell

#91510 - 01/20/05 02:02 PM Re: Panel in basement  
markp  Offline
Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 60
Kent, WA, USA
Greg's answer is correct, however you'll find that most panels have little bump outs where the mounting screws go that just happen to protrude about 1/4 of an inch.

If your panel is like this, you should be able to mount it on concrete. However, if the poured wall isn't all that smooth, or the forms weren't well aligned, you may have concrete touching the back of the panel in places. Usually, this is right where you want a screw to go such as for a grounding bar or the main bonding jumper.

I'd suggest using some washers or short slices of 1/2" PCV conduit to make spacers to get the panel well over 1/4" off the concrete unless its a real smooth wall.


Mark
Kent, WA

#91511 - 01/20/05 06:49 PM Re: Panel in basement  
George Little  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,489
Michigan USA
I'm seeing installers shooting the panel on the poured cement walls and not using anchors and screws. I'm sure they don't maintain the .25" standoff that the dimples on the back of the panel provide. Am I getting to picky in my old age?


George Little

#91512 - 01/21/05 03:44 AM Re: Panel in basement  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,099
Estero,Fl,usa
I guess it all depends on what the chance of moisture accumulating behind the cabinet.


Greg Fretwell

#91513 - 01/21/05 07:35 AM Re: Panel in basement  
Megawatt  Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 76
Lexington,Ky, USA
I buy a 4'x8'piece of plywood, & have it cut into 3 pcs @ the Big Blue Box.
Makes a very neat looking installation, & will insure that the panel will not rust.


#91514 - 01/21/05 11:39 PM Re: Panel in basement  
Speedy Petey  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 173
Upstate, NY
Who in their right mind would shoot a panel up with pins, especially right to the concrete?
Sound bush league to me.


Speedy Petey

"Anyone who has never made a mistake has never tried anything new." -Albert Einstein

#91515 - 01/22/05 04:54 PM Re: Panel in basement  
PCBelarge  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 681
Dobbs Ferry, NY, USA
312.2 requires the 1/4 inch space. If the installer chooses to install the panel directly to the surface (provided it has the 1/4 inch 'dimple', that is acceptable as per code. Going beyond the code is great, but cannot be enforced.

Pierre


Pierre Belarge

#91516 - 01/22/05 05:45 PM Re: Panel in basement  
pauluk  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
Norfolk, England
Not directly relevant to the NEC I know, but back in the days when British houses had basements or cellars the normal approach was to mount a sheet of plywood to the walls using porcelain standoffs, leaving a gap of about 3/8 to 1/2-inch.

The standoffs were designed in such a way that they went right through the board, effectively providing not only mechanical separation but also electrical insulation between board and fixing screws.



Member Spotlight
Admin
Admin
NY, USA
Posts: 3,447
Joined: October 2000
Show All Member Profiles 
Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Shout Box
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.019s Queries: 14 (0.003s) Memory: 0.8084 MB (Peak: 0.9851 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2017-07-24 12:48:02 UTC