ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
Top Posters(30 Days)
Potseal 11
Recent Posts
Dimmable LED 2x4 lay in fixtures
by HotLine1. 04/24/17 05:43 PM
Old decora style outlets
by Lostazhell. 04/22/17 07:59 PM
Permit Snafus...AHJs and Contractors Jump in
by gfretwell. 04/22/17 01:11 PM
How do you find a good employee?
by HotLine1. 04/22/17 10:44 AM
Electrode boilers question
by SteveFehr. 04/21/17 08:32 AM
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
Popular Topics(Views)
234,684 Are you busy
169,411 Re: Forum
162,730 Need opinion
Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 89 guests, and 10 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
#90189 - 11/02/04 12:35 PM Disconnecting Communication Ckts In Classified Area  
mustangelectric  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 494
Bentonville, AR
Hi,
is it required to disconnect all communications when an E-stop is activated in a Classified area...like at a fueling station?

Art. 514.11 is disconnects and 514.13 is all about maint.

thanks for any replies..

-regards

Mustang

[This message has been edited by mustangelectric (edited 11-02-2004).]

[This message has been edited by mustangelectric (edited 11-02-2004).]


Electricity has no respect for ignorance!

2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides

#90190 - 11/02/04 05:18 PM Re: Disconnecting Communication Ckts In Classified Area  
George Little  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,489
Michigan USA
Mustang, I'm not sure what you are calling a "fueling station" but if it is a gas station look at 514.11 and 514.13. Your post made me get the book out but that's okay. [Linked Image]


George Little

#90191 - 11/02/04 05:32 PM Re: Disconnecting Communication Ckts In Classified Area  
mustangelectric  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 494
Bentonville, AR
Hi,
thanks for the reply. Yes this is a gas station. the inspector wants all communications and computers to comply with art 514.11 and 514.13 which I say we do becasue the pumps are shunt trip and as I understand it this does not disconnect the communications or computers...514.13 covers MAINTENANCE and to do that all you need to do is operate the OCPD or disconnect the attachment plug for the device..

follow me?

thanks for any replies..

-regards

Mustang

[This message has been edited by mustangelectric (edited 11-02-2004).]


Electricity has no respect for ignorance!

#90192 - 11/02/04 05:49 PM Re: Disconnecting Communication Ckts In Classified Area  
walrus  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 680
Bangor Me. USA
Where are these communications?? In a classified area??.Are they in a kiosk? How does a shunt trip switch the neutral??


#90193 - 11/02/04 06:16 PM Re: Disconnecting Communication Ckts In Classified Area  
mustangelectric  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 494
Bentonville, AR
Hi,
The communications is a call button and speaker mounted at the dispenser..

This is a classified area up to 18". Shunt trip opens grounded and ungrounded conductors..

-regards

Mustang


Electricity has no respect for ignorance!

#90194 - 11/02/04 06:31 PM Re: Disconnecting Communication Ckts In Classified Area  
walrus  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 680
Bangor Me. USA
You have a 3 pole shunt trip? that has a space for the neutral(grounded conductor)? If so who makes it?, thats alot easier than a relay.
Interesting point on call button and speaker, don't use call buttons and speakers are generally built into pump but could cause a spark. Never seen the speakers shut off with a panic button.

Is this location unattended?


#90195 - 11/02/04 08:09 PM Re: Disconnecting Communication Ckts In Classified Area  
mustangelectric  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 494
Bentonville, AR
Hi,
This is an attended public fueling station. There is a relay and there is a shunt trip I cannot say who makes it but I can try and find out. I am thinking Cutler Hammer.

The article 514.11 is talking about disconnecting the circuit to the dispenser pump and any auxillary power such as for lighting. It does not address the low voltage circuits. Article 514.13 is talking about maintenance and being able to remove power to communications and computers etc. but for maint. not emergency. If I am interpreting it coreectly..

thanks for the replies..

-regards

Mustang


Electricity has no respect for ignorance!

#90196 - 11/02/04 09:30 PM Re: Disconnecting Communication Ckts In Classified Area  
walrus  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 680
Bangor Me. USA
If its an attended self serv, I don't see where the NEC requires an E Stop that shuts all dispensers down at once.


#90197 - 11/03/04 02:01 PM Re: Disconnecting Communication Ckts In Classified Area  
mustangelectric  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 494
Bentonville, AR
Hi,
Please see 514.11 (a)for requirement.

-regards

Mustang


Electricity has no respect for ignorance!


Member Spotlight
BEAMEUP
BEAMEUP
WA
Posts: 27
Joined: December 2004
Show All Member Profiles 
Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Shout Box
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.015s Queries: 14 (0.004s) Memory: 0.8006 MB (Peak: 0.9702 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2017-04-25 18:18:54 UTC