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#82220 - 10/25/02 10:11 PM Removing 210.8 from 2005 NEC  
Fred  Offline
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 449
Straughn, IN 47387
Who has read Mike Holt's Newsletter about the proposed removal of the AFCI requirement from the 2005 NEC? I would be interested to hear comments.

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#82221 - 10/25/02 10:53 PM Re: Removing 210.8 from 2005 NEC  
Jacuzzi Guy Electric  Offline
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 33
Dearborn Heights Michigan Unit...
I love the idea. I will save me tons of money on those expensive breakers.

#82222 - 10/25/02 11:47 PM Re: Removing 210.8 from 2005 NEC  
txsparky  Offline
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 552
Magnolia,.Texas U.S.A.
If a $35 breaker saves 1 life regardless of how many installs, dont you think it's worth it?

Jaccuzzi Guy...How will it save you tons of money? Don't you charge for materials? or do you just give them away?


#82223 - 10/26/02 01:02 AM Re: Removing 210.8 from 2005 NEC  
resqcapt19  Offline
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
The correct code section for the AFCI rule is 210.12.


#82224 - 10/26/02 01:25 AM Re: Removing 210.8 from 2005 NEC  
nesparky  Offline
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 642
I agree with mike holt.
Maybe one day AFCI will live up to the sales pitch and scare tactics of salesmen.
Untill that technology can extinguish a loose conection fault, I doubt it will ever save a life or prevent a fire.


#82225 - 10/26/02 07:57 AM Re: Removing 210.8 from 2005 NEC  
Electricmanscott  Offline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,457
Holden, MA USA
I would actually lose money if this were removed. 4 AFCI breakers @ $30.00 Ea = $120.00 my cost plus 30% markup in my pocket thats nine bucks per breaker. Now 30% on a $3.50 regular breaker is only a buck and some change. Which would you rather sell. I know so many guys who are always looking for the cheapest way out and I don't get. I use dimmers on everything when I do a kitchen remodel. I use undercabinet lights with tranformers and I sell electronic low voltage dimmers for these at ninety bucks a piece. There is a nice profit to be made without any addtional work if you just upgrade the materials.

#82226 - 10/26/02 08:02 AM Re: Removing 210.8 from 2005 NEC  
sparky  Offline
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,311
but then you'd need to stand behind the products you're peddaling.
This includes the products efficy, reliability, and 'sales pitch'

#82227 - 10/26/02 08:08 AM Re: Removing 210.8 from 2005 NEC  
Electricmanscott  Offline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,457
Holden, MA USA
Sparky I see your point in regards to backing the product as it pertains to the AFCI. I was just gerneralizing on cost and profit. It will certainly be interesting to see where this goes. I suspect there are probably many of these afcis installed at a huge cost to homeowners. In my mind if you remove this now you are admitting a huge mistake and misrepresentation of the product which may get the lawyers scrambling for some class action on the behalf of duped consumers.

#82228 - 10/26/02 10:55 AM Re: Removing 210.8 from 2005 NEC  
sparky66wv  Offline
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,236
West Virginia

You don't do bid jobs? All T&M?


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#82229 - 10/26/02 11:25 AM Re: Removing 210.8 from 2005 NEC  
Electricmanscott  Offline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,457
Holden, MA USA
66, Mostly t&m which keeps things pretty comfortable for me. If I do bid a job I bid it to make money and I use the materials that I figure the price with. I would not bid with the good stuff and then substitue it for el cheapo's. I must admit I have a better than average situation going here. I do work for a company that specializes in mid to high end kitchen remodels. I bill clients directly with no middleman. All they ask in return is that I am there for them when they need me. I rarely have to bid a job with these guys as they sell me to the clients. Best part... money is rarely an issue, although I have noticed in the last couple of months that money is becoming more of an issue. Eh what was this topic about again...

[This message has been edited by Electricmanscott (edited 10-26-2002).]

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