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Some electrical engineers should have to install their plans... #7524
02/09/02 01:53 AM
02/09/02 01:53 AM
3
3rd degree Burns  Offline OP
Member
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 36
Dallas, Texas, USA
Another journeyman & I (with 2 helpers) are now into our 4th week of turning a new & empty 80'x30' into the control room of the soon to be largest switch on the biggest trunk (345KV) in Texas. I know they(the utility)are exempt from code but there ARE some strange things, such as using white (as well as green) for phase, but using black for ground. OK...I got over that one. Next, after installing the overhead trays, AC & DC panels, etc., I wire in the requisite 5 rows of the usual cheesy fluorescent fixtures and receptacles according to prints. At this point we still haven't received the panel schedules, but hey.... they show the circuit numbers on the lighting and receptacle prints (AC 43X, AC44X, AC45Y, AC46Y, etc.), and, knowing service will be 240v.(X&Y), I mount both panels (1-42)&(43-84)and terminate the 120v. stuff. This week the panel schedules finally show up...and when I saw how the engineer has arbitrarily choosen to number the circuits according to his idea of the actual number of circuits with no correlation to panel numbers, well........ Example, if the first breaker on the left hand side was a two-pole 240v breaker, one would normally number the first wire #1(X-black) and the red wire below it #3(Y-red). Said engineer instead chooses AC1X and AC1Y. OK.....I can learn to live with that. BUT....I'm running service this coming Monday and I wonder how AM I going to pull FOUR 4/0 THW's for a distance of 150' through a single 2" underground PVC with two 90's ? (from the 200 A. disconnect I installed out by the transfer switch all the way into the control room to my distribution panels). But this IS what the customer calls for...and the plans MUST BE FOLLOWED!!!

[This message has been edited by 3rd degree Burns (edited 02-09-2002).]

[This message has been edited by 3rd degree Burns (edited 02-09-2002).]

[This message has been edited by 3rd degree Burns (edited 02-09-2002).]

Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades
Re: Some electrical engineers should have to install their plans... #7525
02/09/02 06:51 AM
02/09/02 06:51 AM
S
sparky  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,344
LOL!, 3rd Deg.........get the pull 1/2 way there, play the 'dope' and ask him how to do it.

Re: Some electrical engineers should have to install their plans... #7526
02/09/02 12:54 PM
02/09/02 12:54 PM
electure  Offline

Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,264
Fullerton, CA USA
Send a Request for Information to the engineer, detailing your problem.
(He'll try to shirk it off, of course)
Then, give them a price to run a properly sized conduit overhead. Make sure you get a signed Change Order before you proceed with the work.

Re: Some electrical engineers should have to install their plans... #7527
02/09/02 01:10 PM
02/09/02 01:10 PM
R
resqcapt19  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
IL
Four 4/0 THWNs or XHHWs will fit in 2" schedule 40 PVC. Are the 90's PVC or rigid? The pull rope will probably cut through the 90's if they are PVC.
Don(resqcapt19)


Don(resqcapt19)
Re: Some electrical engineers should have to install their plans... #7528
02/09/02 06:50 PM
02/09/02 06:50 PM
sparky66wv  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,236
West Virginia
In a pinch, buy some nylon webbing from a caver or mountain climbing supply, (or any other source if you can find it...) 1" to 1-1/4" wide is good. It will be less likely to cut into the PVC Sweeps.


-Virgil
Residential/Commercial Inspector
5 Star Inspections
Member IAEI
Re: Some electrical engineers should have to install their plans... #7529
02/09/02 07:00 PM
02/09/02 07:00 PM
R
resqcapt19  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
IL
Sparky,
In a rope rescue class I was taught that moving nylon straps on any type of pastic was something to avoid. They said there was too much heat build up and the nylon could fail. Of course this was for life safety not pulling wire. I've never tried a nylon strap, but often use rigid 90s in under ground runs. I've also had good luck soaping the pull rope.
Don(resqcapt19)


Don(resqcapt19)
Re: Some electrical engineers should have to install their plans... #7530
02/09/02 07:05 PM
02/09/02 07:05 PM
sparky66wv  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,236
West Virginia
Hmmm!?!? Allegheny Power uses webbing for UG pulls, mabe it's not Nylon?

What about bonding concerns with the lone GRC sweeps in the middle of PVC runs?

[This message has been edited by sparky66wv (edited 02-09-2002).]


-Virgil
Residential/Commercial Inspector
5 Star Inspections
Member IAEI
Re: Some electrical engineers should have to install their plans... #7531
02/09/02 07:41 PM
02/09/02 07:41 PM
R
resqcapt19  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
IL
Sparky,
I've never used them above grade and the code permits them to be unbonded when they are covered with 18" of earth. See Exception #3 to 250.86.
Don(resqcapt19)


Don(resqcapt19)
Re: Some electrical engineers should have to install their plans... #7532
02/09/02 07:45 PM
02/09/02 07:45 PM
N
Nick  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 599
Riverside, CA
GRC sweeps so not need to be bonded if they are at least 18” underground.

I have found that mule tape works real good. It has footage marks every foot too.

Re: Some electrical engineers should have to install their plans... #7533
02/09/02 09:52 PM
02/09/02 09:52 PM
R
resqcapt19  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
IL
What is "mule" tape.
If I'm pulling anything like that it would be with tugger and the rope that goes with it.
Don(resqcapt19)


Don(resqcapt19)
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