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Accidental Arson.... Hmmm #46524
12/25/04 10:00 AM
12/25/04 10:00 AM
sparky66wv  Offline OP
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,236
West Virginia
Long Story Short:

Friend of mine has house catch on fire, damage not too bad, but bad enough.

Fire started in flue, apparently due to a damper being opened too much on a woodstove.

Fire Marshall declares it "Accidental Arson", claims it has a possible 1-to-5 attached and makes certain the insurance won't pay.

Accidental Arson?

Hunh!?!?!?!?!

Oh yeah, Fire Marshall controls electrical licensing here, so it's kinda related to electrical work...




[This message has been edited by sparky66wv (edited 12-25-2004).]


-Virgil
Residential/Commercial Inspector
5 Star Inspections
Member IAEI
Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades
Re: Accidental Arson.... Hmmm #46525
12/25/04 10:56 AM
12/25/04 10:56 AM
S
Sir Arcsalot  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 127
Lynden, Washington
"Accidental Arson"? That's like saying "I accidentally threw the ball with all the strength I could muster".

Something's wrong with that picture.


No wire bias here- I'm standing on neutral ground.
Re: Accidental Arson.... Hmmm #46526
12/25/04 11:15 AM
12/25/04 11:15 AM
G
ga.sparky56  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 558
young harris georgia usa
Hmmm....according to my dictionary,Arson is defined as: "The willful or malicious burning of a property"

The words "Arson" and "accident" are mutually exclusive as defined by the dictionary. What a world.

Russell

Re: Accidental Arson.... Hmmm #46527
12/25/04 12:10 PM
12/25/04 12:10 PM
C
Coastal  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 23
Kill Devil Hills, NC 27948
Your friend should consult his attorney. I have heard of "homeowner negligence" but never "accidental arson".

Re: Accidental Arson.... Hmmm #46528
12/25/04 03:32 PM
12/25/04 03:32 PM
P
pauluk  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
Norfolk, England
Yeah, I'd challenge this one. "Accidental arson" is a contradiction in terms.

Re: Accidental Arson.... Hmmm #46529
12/25/04 05:15 PM
12/25/04 05:15 PM
W
wa2ise  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 785
Oradell NJ USA
Maybe it's similar to "involuntary homicide" in that, sure you didn't mean to do it, but you should have been more careful. ?

Re: Accidental Arson.... Hmmm #46530
12/25/04 08:29 PM
12/25/04 08:29 PM
N
NJ Wireman  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 186
New Jersey (South Jersey)
12 years firefighting never heard of such a thing. its either a accident or its arson

Re: Accidental Arson.... Hmmm #46531
12/25/04 08:41 PM
12/25/04 08:41 PM
W
Wirenuttt  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 267
Massachusetts
Sounds OXYMORONICAL!

Re: Accidental Arson.... Hmmm #46532
12/26/04 12:05 AM
12/26/04 12:05 AM
Trumpy  Offline

Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 8,231
SI,New Zealand
Virgil,
It sounds like your friend has dealt a cruel blow there, mate.
Having a house damaged caused by the soot in the chimney catching fire, is a common occurence where I come from and I expect it happens in other places as well.
But, to have a Fire Marshall come up with something like that, is wierd to say the least!.
There is a clear-cut line between a Deliberately-Lit fire and an Accidental fire.
And I reckon that the Fire Marshall is just being spitefull.
Where is the evidence of an Accelerant?
What time of the day did this occur?, Do you know what day it is?, would be the questions I would be asking of the Fire Marshall.
Arson is a very tough call and one that I would not use as a Fire Officer, until such time as a decent investigation had been performed, as in this case though, it doesn't sound like this has been done.
Just as a final note, where I can't find the cause of a fire, I usually get other people in to have a look as well, for thier opinion, I'm all for honest decisions on fire causes, especially where it concerns Insurance claims, either way!. [Linked Image]

Re: Accidental Arson.... Hmmm #46533
12/26/04 11:14 AM
12/26/04 11:14 AM
D
DougW  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,143
North Chicago, IL
Quote
Originally posted by NJ Wireman:

12 years firefighting never heard of such a thing. its either a accident or its arson


Right with you on that one. It's intentional, accidental, or negligence. Insurance pays for the last two...

This feeble 'determination' by the Fire Marshal sounds like, at best, a personal grudge gone wrong. By your mention of electrical work, did this FM/AHJ have it out for your friend... maybe over a past inspection?

It's up to the insurance company's claim adjuster. Very rarely do they completely rely on the AHJ for a C&O determination. Ususally they will meet with the investigator, and comapre notes, but it's up to the insurer to make a "pay or not" call.

I'd tell your friend to contact his insurance company and explain the situation... also, call the Office of the State Fire Marshal, and request an "independent" investigator. You might also try http://www.firearson.com - the International Association of Arson Investigators, and see if they can connect your freind to an independent, professional investigator for a "second opinion" to counter this mope.

Anyone remember "Fire Marshal Bill" on the old "In Living Color" show? This sounds like him, in person...

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