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#44603 - 11/08/04 07:42 PM Surge Protection/ Phone Equipment  
PAUL0510  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 13
AVON MA. USA
Hello all

I have a coupple of questions. I was wondeing about surge protectors for residential panels. How many people install them and how well do the work? Has anyone had to replace one? How many homeowners request them? I was also wondering about phone line test equipment. What are some of the tools you guys and gals use? I want to be able to dial out and recieve calls as well as test for proper conections. I wish i had more time to to look over the site, it's informative. I recently got my licence but you never stop learning. Great site, keep up the good work.


Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades

#44604 - 11/08/04 08:53 PM Re: Surge Protection/ Phone Equipment  
hbiss  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 886
Hawthorne, NY USA
Surge protectors:
Do I install them? Yes
Do they work? Yes
Do they have to be replaced? Yes
Do homeowners request them? Not usually- I have to recommend them.

As for telecom test, all you will ever need is a simple butt set and an adapter to be able to connect the test leads to a phone jack. Both are available from Harris, Progressive, Leviton and others.

-Hal


#44605 - 11/09/04 12:20 AM Re: Surge Protection/ Phone Equipment  
e57  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,876
S.F.,CA USA
Would also say that you should get a "DSL safe" Butt-set, regular ones will drop the DSL signal, and / or damage equipment.

And, a tone / receiver kit for tracing out lines. (Also usefull for many other applications)

Surge Rpotectors: same as Hal


Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason

#44606 - 11/09/04 02:49 PM Re: Surge Protection/ Phone Equipment  
hbiss  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 886
Hawthorne, NY USA
Would also say that you should get a "DSL safe" Butt-set, regular ones will drop the DSL signal, and / or damage equipment.

Then get ready to spend big bucks! The Harris's that we have are almost $500 each. We have some others that just "lock out" and beep when connected to an ADSL line. Big PITA. Not real good when you need to identify that line and you can't draw dial tone.

DSL lines shouldn't really be that kind of an issue in residential and small commercial anyway. We often go into terminals and cross connects with 100's of lines and have no idea what each line is but in residential there is only one or two and you should know what they are.

It's also no big deal if you do clip a regular butt set across an ADSL line. Yup, you will interrupt the connection but it will recover. If you want to be safe and save a lot of money just use a DSL filter with your butt set.

-Hal


#44607 - 11/09/04 07:56 PM Re: Surge Protection/ Phone Equipment  
Bjarney  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 2,527
West-Southern Inner-Northeast ...
 
One "aftermarket" gizmo is http://assets.twacomm.com/pdf/2583.pdf


#44608 - 11/09/04 10:03 PM Re: Surge Protection/ Phone Equipment  
hbiss  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 886
Hawthorne, NY USA
Thanks Bjarney, I was going to suggest that but I couldn't think of where I saw it.

If you are not using your butt set day in and day out a cheap butt set and this will work well for you and save you some money.

Edit to add that this will also serve as an adapter that lets you connect the test leads to a phone jack.

-Hal

[This message has been edited by hbiss (edited 11-09-2004).]


#44609 - 11/09/04 11:44 PM Re: Surge Protection/ Phone Equipment  
e57  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,876
S.F.,CA USA
Hal, "interrupt the connection but it will recover." Used to think that too, untill I knocked out an office for 6 hours when it "recovered", They were NOT happy, and we did not get paid.

I run into ADSL and SDSL lines on almost every job now, ( ADSL in 85% of residential here! SDSL and fractional or full T-1+ in Commercial) most are un-marked / tagged. Often find T-1 lines simularly un-tagged. Splitter or filter may not save you on that. (Don't want to find out either)

Better safe than sorry.....


Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason

#44610 - 11/10/04 03:02 AM Re: Surge Protection/ Phone Equipment  
hbiss  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 886
Hawthorne, NY USA
untill I knocked out an office for 6 hours when it "recovered. They were NOT happy, and we did not get paid.

Well, I offer my sympathies but I would have stood my ground and made them pay. As far as I'm concerned too bad! I wouldn't be so quick to accept responsibility. The fault lies with the equipment, not you. This is the real world and line problems happen all the time. If each time a momentary short or load appears on the line the service takes 6 hours to recover I would go after the service provider or the computer guy. Somebody's doing something wrong and it's not you.

I might add that T1 and HDSL circuits are supposed to be identified on blocks and terminals. We and any TELCO that I have seen will put red caps on the 66 block clips and binding posts for those pairs. Again, if they are not indicated it's not your problem.

We get this from customers from time to time- "It was working till you got here". Probably was. Sometimes I hate to go poking around on the blocks or wiring because many times it is so poorly done that you cause other problems just by touching it. If each time this happened we felt sorry and didn't charge the customer we would be loosing money. We'll fix the problem but you can be sure they will be charged for that in addition to what we were originally there for.

-Hal



[This message has been edited by hbiss (edited 11-10-2004).]


#44611 - 11/11/04 04:47 PM Re: Surge Protection/ Phone Equipment  
electech  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 113
Northern Il
Central office equipment is usually required to be NEBS compliant - meaning it must pass telcordia GR-63 and GR-1089 requirements. A piece of CO or remote equipment that does not recover from tip to ring shorts or tip/ring to ground shorts is NOT GR-1089 compliant. The applicable GR-1089 test involves shorting the leads for 30 minutes and verifying the unit under test recovers without manual intervention. Even if the manufacturer wasn't claiming NEBS or GR-1089 compliance, a piece of telecom equipment that won't recover from that most basic of fault conditions is absolute junk. The designers should be most embarassed.



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