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#23866 03/29/03 05:51 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,457
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Member
Installing a service in an old barn today. Could not get the ground rods in. (bedrock?) Instead I laid them in the trench that the service is run in. It is about three feet deep. I used three rods, each one six feet from the other. Reading through the handbook I am not to clear on this exact situation. Appreciate all thoughts.

#23867 03/29/03 07:39 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 449
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Scott. According to 250.53(G) you've satisfied the NEC providing the trench you put them in was at least 30" deep. Sounds like you did the best anyone could do and then some.

#23868 03/29/03 08:41 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 198
Z
Member
20' of #4 bare copper would be acceptable in the ditch too, if your AHJ has no problems with that.


Shoot first, apologize later.....maybe
#23869 03/29/03 09:21 PM
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
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Zapped,
Please cite the code section that permits the use of 20' of #4 in a ditch as a grounding electrode.
Don


Don(resqcapt19)
#23870 03/29/03 10:20 PM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 8,443
Likes: 3
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We do this sort of thing all the time in New Zealand, especially where a really good Earth is required, we lay out about 20-30 metres of 35-50mm2, for really poor soils and it works a treat.
This sort of system is really only used for Earthing Distribution Transformers and the like, no one would like a bill for this sort of wire at these lengths. [Linked Image]

#23871 03/29/03 10:51 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 198
Z
Member
Don,- While there is no direct code section stating we can install the electrode system as I said, there also is no wording that says I cannot. Basicly we are using 250.52(A3&4) without the concrete. On our larger services we use 2,3,&4/0 copper. Our AHJ's have no problems with these installations. Don't get me wrong, I do use ground rods 90% of the time.


Shoot first, apologize later.....maybe
#23872 03/29/03 11:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 16
D
Member
Scott, what you did will satisfy code. Another option would have been to use a ground ring or plate electrode.

#23873 03/30/03 12:06 AM
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
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zapped,
There is wording that says you can't do that. The code lists the grounding electrodes that are permitted to be used in 250.52. Installing 20' of bare copper in a ditch is not on the list, unless the 20' encircles a building. I see no reason why it shouldn't be just as good as a ground ring, but it is not permitted by the NEC rules.


Don(resqcapt19)
#23874 03/30/03 12:47 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 939
F
Member
don :

i hate to ask you a stupid question but i know i will respect you with this one anyway but you mean that cant bury bare copper wire unless it is around the building that mean all the way around the building area ???
( i never done this one so i am double checking i did see it on nec code say cant bury it in short straght section ..)


thanks for your time


merci marc


Pas de problme,il marche n'est-ce pas?"(No problem, it works doesn't it?)

#23875 03/30/03 12:55 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 198
Z
Member
Don,- Maybe the CMP should take a closer look at 250.52(A4), kinda hard to take 20' of wire and encircle a 25+ 40' building.


Shoot first, apologize later.....maybe
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