ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
Top Posters(30 Days)
Potseal 11
Recent Posts
Dimmable LED 2x4 lay in fixtures
by Potseal. 04/23/17 07:18 PM
Old decora style outlets
by Lostazhell. 04/22/17 07:59 PM
Permit Snafus...AHJs and Contractors Jump in
by gfretwell. 04/22/17 01:11 PM
How do you find a good employee?
by HotLine1. 04/22/17 10:44 AM
Electrode boilers question
by SteveFehr. 04/21/17 08:32 AM
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
Popular Topics(Views)
234,654 Are you busy
169,347 Re: Forum
162,687 Need opinion
Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 75 guests, and 8 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#22225 - 02/20/03 05:39 PM Hooking up multiple appliances!  
quickquestion  Offline
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1
Seattle, WA
Hi.

I live in an older home that has one 20 Amp fuse connected to 12-2 wire running a fridge, and 2 electrical outlets. The frige says it takes 2.4 amps. I would like to install a diswasher on the same circuit, because it would be too messy to try and run a wire back to the circuit panel. Does this circuit have the ability to run the fridge, an 8.6 amp dishwasher, and possibly a portable microwave (amperage unknown, but a small one) without tripping the circuit breaker? I have heard current code requires all kitchen appliances to be on their own circut, however, for theoritical purposes I am trying to gain an understanding of what the 20 amp circut is capable of running?

Thanks.


P.

Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades

#22226 - 02/20/03 08:44 PM Re: Hooking up multiple appliances!  
Elzappr  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 270
Oregon
As you noted, its against code. Therefore, end of story.


#22227 - 02/20/03 10:28 PM Re: Hooking up multiple appliances!  
HotLine1  Offline


Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,808
Brick, NJ USA
Quickly and simplified reply:
What you propose is a NEC violation
A 20 amp circuit should not be "loaded" over 80% or 16 amps.
A refrig has a larger "starting" current.
A dishwasher has a "starting" current also.

If as you say, installing another line" will be "messy"; consider a professional opinion, and hire a qualified licensed electrical contractor. (Most of us do not leave a "mess".

John


John

#22228 - 02/21/03 11:16 AM Re: Hooking up multiple appliances!  
George  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 375
You will have no problem in running your refrig and dishwasher off of the same circuit.

Your microwave may trip the breaker if run while the dishwasher is running.

Is it code compliant?

You are free to "plug" your appliances into any recept your wish.

If each appliance is required to have its own circuit, an electrictian may not "design and install" what you propose.


#22229 - 02/21/03 12:51 PM Re: Hooking up multiple appliances!  
C-H  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,497
Stockholm, Sweden
Quote

The frige says it takes 2.4 amps.


2.4A @ 120V = 288VA. Unless it's a huge or ancient fridge it won't be running all the time. Therefore, the average load should be much lower than 2.4A

Quote

Does this circuit have the ability to run the fridge, an 8.6 amp dishwasher, and possibly a portable microwave (amperage unknown, but a small one) without tripping the circuit breaker?


2.4 + 8.6 = 11A, which leaves 9A. This means that the microwave must draw 9A*120V = 1080VA or less. The small microwave I have draws 500W, so yes, it should work. All under the assumption that you won't be using the appliances 24 hours/day. [Linked Image]


#22230 - 02/21/03 01:22 PM Re: Hooking up multiple appliances!  
mamills  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 745
Wharton, Texas, USA
QQ:
Living in an older house myself, I tend to err on the side of safety. If the circuit is protected by a 20a fuse (which seems to date this electric installation), I would not feel good about even loading it to 80%. At the very least, I would put the microwave on a dedicated circuit. While your electrician is installing the circuit, ask him to evaluate the condition of the existing circuit and receptacles. Since he is in the walls, ceilings, etc., he might be able to install two circuits as easily as one (and replace the existing 12-2 with 12-2/Ground).

Just my thoughts... [Linked Image]

Mike (mamills)

[This message has been edited by mamills (edited 02-21-2003).]


#22231 - 02/21/03 06:52 PM Re: Hooking up multiple appliances!  
Electricmanscott  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,457
Holden, MA USA
I guarantee a house fire would be FAR messier than running a new circuit. Please don't let the messiness of the job be the deciding factor. Safety (the basis of codes) should be the decision maker. Run a new circuit for the dishwasher and sleep better at night.


#22232 - 02/21/03 10:53 PM Re: Hooking up multiple appliances!  
Elzappr  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 270
Oregon
The code doesn't permit using the 20 Amp kitchen appliance circuits for your dishwasher.


#22233 - 02/22/03 12:44 AM Re: Hooking up multiple appliances!  
SvenNYC  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,691
New York City
If current code requires a separate circuit for every kitchen appliance, then that means you'd need a circuit (socket) for the toaster, one for the electric tea kettle or coffee percolator, one for the Frigidaire, one for the blender, one for the ferocious-looking electric hot dog cooker ( [Linked Image]), etc. And don't forget one for the radio (the most important kitchen appliance in my book!).

That would make for a lot of outlets and a big fuse/breaker box, wouldn't it....not to mention a mess of wires behind the wall.... [Linked Image]

I've never seen a kitchen with more than three duplex sockets (not counting the one used for the Frigidaire).

One in particular has one 20 amp receptacle circuit with a duplex socket and the other one is a 15 amp with two duplex receptacles.


#22234 - 02/22/03 09:06 AM Re: Hooking up multiple appliances!  
Texas_Ranger  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,393
Vienna, Austria
You forgot the TV on the shelf above the sink. [Linked Image]


Page 1 of 2 1 2

Member Spotlight
Scott35
Scott35
Anaheim, CA. USA
Posts: 2,707
Joined: October 2000
Show All Member Profiles 
Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Shout Box
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.016s Queries: 15 (0.003s) Memory: 0.8175 MB (Peak: 0.9936 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2017-04-24 21:07:49 UTC