ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
Top Posters(30 Days)
Recent Posts
VFD MotorFeeders
by gfretwell. 10/17/17 10:01 PM
What do you do?
by gfretwell. 10/17/17 01:08 AM
Good ol' copper pipe in the fuse holder trick
by HotLine1. 10/16/17 07:16 PM
Generator Cable Sizing
by HotLine1. 10/16/17 07:13 PM
Another generator question
by HotLine1. 10/16/17 07:02 PM
New in the Gallery:
Gallery Test
Popular Topics(Views)
241,353 Are you busy
177,304 Re: Forum
168,929 Need opinion
Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 43 guests, and 7 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
#214763 - 01/22/15 04:41 PM Why is a Photocell porch light flickering  
Todd11  Offline
New Member
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 5
Washington, US
Hello.

I manage an apartment building and I have a photocell front door light that is flickering on an off every quarter of a second.

It has a photocell that points down from the fixture. It is happening when it is night time and there is no natural light.

It is using a CFL bulb.

I have the same light in front of 20+ other apartments in the same building configuration and reflective light situation and none of the others have ever had this problem.

I have swapped the light fixture out with another identical fixture and get the same flickering problem.

I have tested the voltage coming to the light and it is a constant 120v (no flickering of the voltage).

If I put black electrical tape over the photocell, the flickering stops and it stays on.

If I take the tape off and shield the photocell with my hands (to block any light reflection) the flickering starts again.

By the way, when I first install the new fixture, it does not flicker right away but starts after a few minutes.

Any suggestions on how to fix the problem other than keeping the tape on there and therefore having the light on 24/7?

Thanks for your help.



Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades

#214768 - 01/22/15 11:10 PM Re: Why is a Photocell porch light flickering [Re: Todd11]  
JoeTestingEngr  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 790
Chicago, Il.
I suspect the photocell ckt. had a cap open up. Check it in daylight. Block it with something opaque, not your hand, and time how long it takes for the light to come on. Remove the cover and observe how long it takes for the light to turn back off. They should both be substantial time delays. But you say you swapped with an identical fixture (known good???) and got the same results? You should still do the timing test on a non-flickering fixture as a basis for comparison.
Secondly, the CdS might be reacting to a non-visible light source. I don't know the spectral response off hand, just that the resistance varies from hundreds of ohms in strong light, to millions of ohms in darkness. A filter film over the window might fix that.
Photocell ckts are designed with hysteresis, also called positive feedback, snap action, differential, deadband, schmitt trigger action, and some I'm forgetting. If some of the light from the fixture that you're controlling, can reflect back to the photocell, you might be exceeding the switching threshold. Or could this light be interacting with another fixture controlled by a photocell??? I had to troubleshoot a complaint about the lights going off at a bus vaulting island a few years ago. I climbed the ladder and eyeballed the viewing window for the photocell. I could see the pretty new street light that the city installed across the street. The fix involved an empty pop can, tin snips and a couple cable ties. I blocked the sight line between the photocell and street light, while still allowing ambient light to enter the window.
Joe


#214769 - 01/22/15 11:15 PM Re: Why is a Photocell porch light flickering [Re: Todd11]  
JoeTestingEngr  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 790
Chicago, Il.
Any new tenants with car alarms that flash super bright LEDs when the system is armed?
Joe


#214770 - 01/22/15 11:39 PM Re: Why is a Photocell porch light flickering [Re: Todd11]  
Todd11  Offline
New Member
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 5
Washington, US
Here is some additional information after my initial post.

When I said it flickers every quarter of a second… To better describe the flicker, it is a constant and consistent on/off/on/off with it pausing just a fraction of a second before it changes (like someone is moving the light switch up and down as fast as they can).

It is hard wired (I bypassed the light switch).

It is actually the third, identical fixture (all from different orders) to do the same flickering.

It is mounted in a very dark place (the other lights don’t shine into the area it is at).

Thanks

Last edited by Todd11; 01/22/15 11:40 PM.

#214771 - 01/23/15 12:28 AM Re: Why is a Photocell porch light flickering [Re: Todd11]  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,122
Estero,Fl,usa
A CFL does not have enough load when off to turn off the PC. You can prove that to yourself by putting in a regular lamp.

I had the same problem with an occupancy sensor.


Greg Fretwell

#214773 - 01/23/15 04:19 AM Re: Why is a Photocell porch light flickering [Re: Todd11]  
Todd11  Offline
New Member
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 5
Washington, US
This Photocell fixture is designed for a CFL (it has a GU24 base) and all of the other identical fixtures on the property are working correctly with CFL’s.

Thanks.


#214774 - 01/23/15 05:06 AM Re: Why is a Photocell porch light flickering [Re: Todd11]  
JoeTestingEngr  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 790
Chicago, Il.
Are you saying that the fixture used to work in this location, and now it doesn't, or has this location always had a problem?
Joe


#214781 - 01/23/15 02:07 PM Re: Why is a Photocell porch light flickering [Re: Todd11]  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,122
Estero,Fl,usa
Is there a white or light colored wall/floor across from this light that is reflecting back at the PC?


Greg Fretwell

#214782 - 01/23/15 02:07 PM Re: Why is a Photocell porch light flickering [Re: Todd11]  
Todd11  Offline
New Member
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 5
Washington, US
Three identical fixtures over the past year have never worked at this location.

I think years ago the same model fixture used to work there but I am not sure on that.

Thanks.


#214783 - 01/23/15 04:47 PM Re: Why is a Photocell porch light flickering [Re: Todd11]  
geoff in UK  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 184
UK
Whatever the exact reason for the problem is you have proved that the photocell is incompatible with that particular application or location. I would suggest a different type or make of photocell, or moving it to a different location, depending on what's most practical.


Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Member Spotlight
mersadrad
mersadrad
Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Posts: 28
Joined: March 2011
Show All Member Profiles 
Featured:

2017 Master Electrician Exam Preparation Combos
2017 NEC Electrician
Exam Prep Combos:
Master / Journeyman

 

Shout Box
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.019s Queries: 16 (0.003s) Memory: 0.8204 MB (Peak: 0.9992 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2017-10-18 07:27:41 UTC