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#202137 - 07/20/11 01:35 PM Replacement outlets  
sparkync  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 829
NC
Does Article 210.12 (B) mean that a GFI outlet is not accepted anymore when replacing ungrounded outlets in an existing dwelling, or am I looking in the wrong place??
Thanks...


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#202139 - 07/20/11 01:53 PM Re: Replacement outlets [Re: sparkync]  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,135
Estero,Fl,usa
The key words are "where branch-circuit wiring is modified, replaced, or extended"

Is simply replacing a receptacle modifying the "wiring"?

Of course when the mysterious device AFCI shows up at the supply house, this is easy to answer ... assuming it is a kind that also has 5ma GF protection.

This is one of those places where the unintended consequences may be worse than the intent. If you can't use a $10 GFCI device, it may end up being replaced with a 40 cent duplex.


Greg Fretwell

#202163 - 07/20/11 09:56 PM Re: Replacement outlets [Re: sparkync]  
HotLine1  Offline


Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,874
Brick, NJ USA
sparkync:

IF you are talking GFI receptacles, you are within the wrong section; you are looking at AFCI requirements.

Go to 406.4 (D)(2)(a,b,c) for replacement of receptacles on an existing two (2) wire crcuit that has NO ground available.

Short answer is 'Yes' you may use a GFI device to replace a 2-wire receptacle.


John

#202165 - 07/20/11 10:21 PM Re: Replacement outlets [Re: sparkync]  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,135
Estero,Fl,usa
I do see his point if you "modified" it in some way you are in a catch 22. The only legal answer is an AFCI breaker in the panel (if it would take one) and a GFCI receptacle in the first outlet. The last I heard C/H is the only one with a combo GFCI/AFCI and that was a breaker, not a "box" device.


Greg Fretwell

#202177 - 07/21/11 01:00 PM Re: Replacement outlets [Re: sparkync]  
sparkync  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 829
NC
Sorry guys. My day was going too fast. I should have looked in the index for "Receptacles" and then under "Replacements" and I would have found it. I share my office area normally with a 2 year old grandson, 6 year old grandson, and an 11 year old granddaughter, now that school is out. It gets hectic sometimes, but you that have grandchildren probably know "the bond". Anyway it keeps me from getting "too involved" in my work sometimes. Constant
time in front of a computer doing estimates etc., can get pretty stressful and give you serious eyestrain:) A little diversion helps sometimes:)


#203287 - 09/18/11 10:14 PM Re: Replacement outlets [Re: sparkync]  
mikethebull  Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 100
Rhode Island
The AHJ for my state has said that is only required in NEW installations on service redo's we don't need to.



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