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#180107 - 08/13/08 02:10 PM Hiding a J-box  
Ragu  Offline
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 7
Elkton, Md USA
I'm wondering if there are any exceptions to buring a junction box behind drywall, no access? i.e. are there any products or devices or means (crimping, welding etc)to allow one to make a permanant splice connection and then not have to leave the j-box accessable? This particular situation is around a residential application.

Thanks


Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades

#180110 - 08/13/08 07:41 PM Re: Hiding a J-box [Re: Ragu]  
EV607797  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 745
Fredericksburg, VA, USA
Well, these things claim to allow you to do this, but I don't trust anything that is buried. I believe that they've been used in modular or manufactured homes for some time. Take a look:

http://www.molex.com/cgi-bin/bv/molex/jsp/family/intro.jsp?BV_SessionID=@@@@1822063810.1218670744@@@@&BV_EngineID=ccceadeelgmemhhcflgcehedffgdfmk.0&superFamOID=-8804&pageTitle=Introduction&channel=Products&familyOID=-9408&chanName=family&frellink=Introduction


---Ed---

"But the guy at Home Depot said it would work."

#180113 - 08/13/08 09:05 PM Re: Hiding a J-box [Re: EV607797]  
HotLine1  Offline


Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,863
Brick, NJ USA
Tyco has a similar item. Last debate here (NJ) was mobile/mod structures. Based on your location, I would suggest that you show the literature from the above link to your area AHJ BEFORE you do it.

My personal opinion....'buried' splices are NG, as Ed said.
BTW, HD probably doesn't stock Molex. As an EC I would replace/rewire/re-feed whatever you are referencing to splice. As an AHJ....buried splices win a red sticker; but a future problem may 'win' you a lot more than that.






John

#180132 - 08/14/08 10:07 AM Re: Hiding a J-box [Re: HotLine1]  
Ragu  Offline
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 7
Elkton, Md USA
First...thank You for the responses...

Ed, what product are you linking to? I'm alittle dense so please excuse my required hand holding. I opened your link, but it goes to the molex home page...i.e. I do not know what product you refering. Can you please give me a name to look for on the Molex site?

Thanks again


#180134 - 08/14/08 10:49 AM Re: Hiding a J-box [Re: Ragu]  
EV607797  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 745
Fredericksburg, VA, USA
Sorry about that. Try this one instead and also click on "solid wire" in the menu box on the left side of the page:

http://www.molex.com/cgi-bin/bv/molex/jsp/family/intro.jsp?BV_SessionID=@@@@0772761061.1218725007@@@@&BV_EngineID=ccceadeelgmemhhcflgcehedffgdfmk.0&oid=-9408&channel=Products&familyOID=-9408&frellink=Introduction&chanName=family&pageTitle=Self-Contained%20Power%20Connector%20|%20Overview


---Ed---

"But the guy at Home Depot said it would work."

#180136 - 08/14/08 12:35 PM Re: Hiding a J-box [Re: EV607797]  
dougwells  Offline


Member
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,140
kamloops BC Canada
There not Allowed in Canada for any purpose but for manufactured homes

http://www.eiabc.org/pdfQuestionSheets/NMD%20Splice%20Kits.pdf


#180137 - 08/14/08 12:37 PM Re: Hiding a J-box [Re: EV607797]  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,113
Estero,Fl,usa
Molex does not seem to be bragging about "concealed" like the Tyco product.
Tyco was saying their splice could exploit 334.40(B)

Quote
Devices of Insulating Material. Switch, outlet, and tap devices of insulating material shall be permitted to be used without boxes in exposed cable wiring and for rewiring in existing buildings where the cable is concealed and fished. Openings in such devices shall form a close fit around the outer covering of the cable, and the device shall fully enclose the part of the cable from which any part of the covering has been removed. Where connections to conductors are by binding-screw terminals, there shall be available as many terminals as conductors.


Greg Fretwell

#180139 - 08/14/08 01:32 PM Re: Hiding a J-box [Re: EV607797]  
goodwill  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 54
Madison, WI, USA
someone should manufacture a "in-wall splice kit" that is just like an underground splice kit. send it in to UL to have it listed for the purpose. I personally would feel way better with a pressure torqued terminal shrink tubed, than I would with a "stab" connection. just thinking out loud...


#180140 - 08/14/08 02:15 PM Re: Hiding a J-box [Re: goodwill]  
Zapped  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 482
Huntington Beach, CA, USA
I don't think that the issue is so much with the ability of a product to make a good, long lasting connection that could be covered and work well for the life of the building and other wiring when properly installed, I think it's the inability to check the quality of the installers work after said splice is buried. Once a device like this is allowed on the market, anybody will be able to get them, and we've all seen the horror of DIYers in action. A badly made splice out of the confines of a box is a fire waiting to happen.


#180141 - 08/14/08 03:27 PM Re: Hiding a J-box [Re: Zapped]  
LK  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,429
New Jersey
"send it in to UL to have it listed for the purpose"


For UL to list a product, the manufacture can spend thousands on testing and then thousands more in product liability insurance, before a product will reach the market place.


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