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#178029 - 05/21/08 06:39 PM ground wires from different circuits in same box  
jdevlin  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 402
welland ontario canada
I am having a debate on another site about ground wires. Can anyone give a code reference that requires all the ground wires one jbox from different circuits to be tied together. Or one that requires them not be tied together.


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#178045 - 05/22/08 06:53 AM Re: ground wires from different circuits in same box [Re: jdevlin]  
SteveFehr  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,206
Chesapeake, VA
I don't think you'll find one. The only real requirement is that they all be electrically connected. So, you can tie them all together, or not tie them together, and it's all the same since they all tie back to the EGC.

Now... you *may* run into issues mixing high and low current circuits and ground paths- if you have a 20A and a 200A circuit going into a single metal box, the metal box is required to be grounded, and I'd argue that any metal in the box- including the bare #12 conductor- is "likely to become energized" and would be required to withstand the fault current from the 200A circuit ...which would require bonding the #12 and #6 ground conductors. So, in that case, 250.122 would apply. Although it *still* doesn't require them to be bonded, it's just the practical thing to do.

Might also come into play if you're mixing #12 and #14 in a box.


#178047 - 05/22/08 07:20 AM Re: ground wires from different circuits in same box [Re: SteveFehr]  
resqcapt19  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
IL
250.148 Continuity and Attachment of Equipment Grounding Conductors to Boxes.
Where circuit conductors are spliced within a box, or terminated on equipment within or supported by a box, any equipment grounding conductor(s) associated with those circuit conductors shall be connected within the box or to the box with devices suitable for the use in accordance with 250.148(A) through (E).


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#178060 - 05/22/08 01:42 PM Re: ground wires from different circuits in same box [Re: resqcapt19]  
jdevlin  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 402
welland ontario canada
This is the article the other person is citing as requiring them to not be connected. He is saying the "associated with those circuit conductors" only refers to each individual circuit not all the separate circuits in the same box.


#178061 - 05/22/08 01:51 PM Re: ground wires from different circuits in same box [Re: jdevlin]  
sparkyinak  Online Content
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,322
Alaska
250.148. Only exception is isolated grounds


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#178075 - 05/22/08 08:06 PM Re: ground wires from different circuits in same box [Re: sparkyinak]  
EV607797  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 745
Fredericksburg, VA, USA
Let's remember that the OP is in Canada. I don't think that our article 250 holds much weight north of the border.


---Ed---

"But the guy at Home Depot said it would work."

#178085 - 05/22/08 10:11 PM Re: ground wires from different circuits in same box [Re: EV607797]  
sparkyinak  Online Content
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,322
Alaska
Dang it I fell for it again! smile I usually look for that. It was posted in the 2008 NEC discussion forum.


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#178105 - 05/23/08 01:27 PM Re: ground wires from different circuits in same box [Re: sparkyinak]  
jdevlin  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 402
welland ontario canada
This is an NEC issue NOT a Canadian issue. It is a discusion I am having at a DIY site trying to convince them that all grounds from different circuits should be connected together or find out if they shouldn't be connected. I always thought they should be.


#178111 - 05/23/08 05:19 PM Re: ground wires from different circuits in same box [Re: jdevlin]  
BPHgravity  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 139
Port Charlotte, Florida
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#178114 - 05/23/08 07:00 PM Re: ground wires from different circuits in same box [Re: BPHgravity]  
EV607797  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 745
Fredericksburg, VA, USA
Regardless of the country, and whether you are an electrician or not, let's stop and think about this for a minute:

Say you have a two-gang metal box in a kitchen housing a switch for the light over the sink (on the lighting circuit) and a receptacle on one of the small appliance circuits. Using Romex (Loomex), how in the world could you possibly keep the grounds separated? Even if you didn't bond them together, there's no chance that those bare conductors aren't going to meet, either by touching the box directly or via the grounding connections to the device yokes. The separate grounds are going to meet at some point. I'd tend to think that an intentional bonding of EGCs would be better than those that may occur through unintentional contact.

I think that with this being said, the answer is obvious.

I think that any code that requires that such circuits be kept separate would be impossible to enforce unless separate device boxes were mandated for separate circuits. It would be even more difficult to comply with such a requirement. I think that pretty much sums up the answer to the original question.


---Ed---

"But the guy at Home Depot said it would work."

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