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10 meters #116602
04/13/04 07:15 AM
04/13/04 07:15 AM
electure  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,264
Fullerton, CA USA
Quote
What's wrong with this picture? All safety switches are being used as
Service Disconnects on a multi occupancy building. Is this dangerous or
is it practical?


George Little


[Linked Image]

Tools for Electricians:
Re: 10 meters #116603
04/13/04 10:20 PM
04/13/04 10:20 PM
Lostazhell  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,431
Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
Are they sandwiched together to the point that the disconnect handles can't move???

-Randy

Re: 10 meters #116604
04/13/04 10:29 PM
04/13/04 10:29 PM
D
DougW  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,143
North Chicago, IL
From the 1996 NEC:

Quote
230-71. Maximum Number of Disconnects

(a) General.
The sevice disconnecting means for each service permitted by Section 230-2, or for each set of service-entrace conductors permitted by Section 230-40, Exception No. 1, shall consist of not more thank six switches or six circuit breakers mounted in a single enclosure, in a group of seperate enclosures, or in or on a switchboard. There shall be no more than six disconnects per service grouped in any one location.


And it's "substantially and materially similar" in the '99 and '02 codes...

Dangerous? Probably not. Practical? Well, if not having to appeal for a zoning variance due to non code compliance when you go to sell the building is practical...

[This message has been edited by DougW (edited 04-13-2004).]

Re: 10 meters #116605
04/13/04 10:32 PM
04/13/04 10:32 PM
Lostazhell  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,431
Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
I knew that! [Linked Image]

Re: 10 meters #116606
04/14/04 05:42 AM
04/14/04 05:42 AM
G
George Corron  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 717
Lorton, Va USA
Guys,
This is quite common in No. VA. The use is for townhouses, or rows of warehouses. The POCO does not (will not) hit them individually, so they choose a common location.

How is it justified???? Why not? Each service has only ONE disconnect (though agreed this one looks as if it may be a bit different), it is only multiple services grouped at a common location.

One of the reasons I don't "pop" on here as much - actually, I do, I just don't answer as many questions- is we do not use the 2002 code, we're on the 99, and I have not updated my class book yet until I know which code we will use. If there is a reference in the 2002 prohibiting this, let me know.

Thanks,

George

Re: 10 meters #116607
04/16/04 12:39 AM
04/16/04 12:39 AM
M
Megawatt  Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 76
Lexington,Ky, USA
Not really dangerous, very practicle...but still a violation in my opinion. Max number of Discos should be 6...7 if one is used for a Fire Pump.
I didn't see the purpose for the CT cabinet,with individual self contained meters, either.
Probably should've calculated the service, & installed a main Disc. but in My location, the POCO won't allow a Disc. before their meters, this is more than likely how this evolved.
I believe I would've tried to get the building Owner to install a main disc, CT metered, & individually metered the 10, or added an estimated cost to the rent, & included it.

Re: 10 meters #116608
04/16/04 06:05 AM
04/16/04 06:05 AM
electure  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,264
Fullerton, CA USA
You cant do that here!
From SoCA Edison's Service requirements:


"A main disconnect shall be installed on the line side of a group of more than six meter sockets,
safety socket boxes, instrument transformer boxes or switchboards.
A main disconnect shall be installed on the line side of groups of two to six meter sockets,
safety socket boxes, instrument transformer boxes or switchboards where groups of switches,
circuit breakers, or disconnects that constitute the meter switch, and the total number of
switches or disconnects exceeds six.2/
The main disconnect may be a fused switch, or a circuit breaker. Where fuses are installed, the
Company is not responsible for their replacement. Main disconnect enclosures containing
unmetered conductors shall be sealable"

...S

Re: 10 meters #116609
04/18/04 09:54 PM
04/18/04 09:54 PM
electure  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,264
Fullerton, CA USA
Just another case of Group Metering:


[Linked Image]

...S

Re: 10 meters #116610
04/18/04 10:37 PM
04/18/04 10:37 PM
Lostazhell  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,431
Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
Electure...
Is this another "Kodak Moment" from your trip into Mexico?
I'm curious if Mexico has ANY type of electrical permit/inspection process? It'd be interesting to see an electrical related accident compilation for down there similar to the one that Bill posted for Ontario Canada https://www.electrical-contractor.net/ESF/Accidents/Accident_Summary_Q1_2004.doc

Interesting... But probably a bit morbid! [Linked Image]

-Randy

PS Is that an "Urban" meter tree? [Linked Image]

Re: 10 meters #116611
04/18/04 11:09 PM
04/18/04 11:09 PM
B
Bjarney  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 2,527
West-Southern Inner-Northeast ...
Another jewel from Joe's Little Shop of (Meter) Horrors at TheMeterGuy.com. [OR]

"Disconnects! Disconnects? We don’t have to show you any steenking disconnects!"

[Linked Image]




[This message has been edited by Bjarney (edited 04-19-2004).]


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