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That's no way to treat water #108068
06/06/04 06:17 AM
06/06/04 06:17 AM
electure  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,264
Fullerton, CA USA
Quote
I went on a prebid job walk, and saw this example of cheapskate maintenance. The first picture is the top of a well. The others are in the underground control room that has water chemicals and part or the storage tank in it


nesparky

[Linked Image]


[Linked Image]


[Linked Image]


[Linked Image]



[This message has been edited by electure (edited 06-06-2004).]

2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
Re: That's no way to treat water #108069
06/06/04 06:18 AM
06/06/04 06:18 AM
electure  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,264
Fullerton, CA USA
Here are some more!!

[Linked Image]


[Linked Image]


[Linked Image]


[Linked Image]

Re: That's no way to treat water #108070
06/06/04 08:32 AM
06/06/04 08:32 AM
P
PCBelarge  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 681
Dobbs Ferry, NY, USA
This is one of the reasons people think 'real' electricians are too expensive. A low ball 'person' (for lack of a better term on a sunday morning) will come in there and do the work for practically nothing and make it work - no safety or professionalism at all.

Now Nesparky comes to the job ... what does he do?
I would not touch this with a 10 foot pole, unless I was PAID to replace all of the work that was previously installed in violation. Walk away with my integrity and loss of time or show these people what a good electrician can do.

Pierre


Pierre Belarge
Re: That's no way to treat water #108071
06/06/04 09:21 AM
06/06/04 09:21 AM
I
iwire  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
North Attleboro, MA USA
We are all different, for one I am not the boss I can not choose where I will and will not work.

That aside I would have no problem installing code compliant wiring in this location and ignoring the rest of the junk work.

I am not an inspector and unless the customer wants me to fix it I will ignore it. (Yes there is a cut off point to that) My refusal to do code compliant wiring in this space will not fix the other work and will only result in the customer getting a fly by nighter to add more dangerous wiring.

My integrity will still be intact as the work I do will meet code.

When the inspector comes in they can determine if things need fixing, and if they have the authority to make it happen.

In the end we should be happy that this customer that normally allows hack work to be done is now hiring a professional.

JMO, Bob


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
Re: That's no way to treat water #108072
06/06/04 09:47 AM
06/06/04 09:47 AM
G
ga.sparky56  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 558
young harris georgia usa
I'll side with Bob.

I get a lot of situations like this,and if I refused to do ANY work unless I could replace the bad stuff I'd be in foul shape for work sometimes.

What I do in a situation like this is document all the code violations I can see,and leave it up to the customer as to repairs. I also document carefully what We are asked to do,and have started taking pictures of before and after,and documenting the work that WE do.

Being as there's no ahj in my home county this is the best we can do. The "all or nothing" approach will work for some in different parts of the country,but not here.


Russell

Re: That's no way to treat water #108073
06/06/04 11:51 AM
06/06/04 11:51 AM
Lostazhell  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,431
Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
cheapskate maintenance?? This is outright dangerous!!! This place obviously gets wet at least on the floor... The romex extension cord cap ended thing wrapped around the compressor could fall into water on this floor.. Since its hardwired (If you wanna call it that)... Someone's gonna end up crispy down here! [Linked Image] another orange cord wired into the 4S box..
With the danger to life factor I'm seeing here, I'm on Pierre's side! I add something down here, code compliant & all, & then something goes wrong with the hack crap.. Who's gonna get the subpoena? Me with my business or Joe Handyman who's already moved on to new victims! [Linked Image]

-Randy

Re: That's no way to treat water #108074
06/06/04 12:43 PM
06/06/04 12:43 PM
I
iwire  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
North Attleboro, MA USA
Randy given what you said what would you do?

I do not worry in the least about being sued for work I did not do.


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
Re: That's no way to treat water #108075
06/06/04 03:53 PM
06/06/04 03:53 PM
P
PCBelarge  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 681
Dobbs Ferry, NY, USA
My statement was and is that I will not take the new work unless they paid for me (or someone else) to fix the 'dangerous' and non-compliant existing work. Everybody has different tolerances for their daily 'routines', I was very fortunate to have enough work the last 25 years that I could walk away from this kind of mess.

These photos show not only bad work, but dangerous work. IF you were to complete new work, if it is filed for (permit), the AHJ should do something about this. But there are many jurisdictions that do not require licenses or permits (I cannot understand why), then I believe that a legitimate installer is still taking a huge liability in his/her hands if not fixing the existing work. Why not walk away? Do you think they really are concerned about your 'quality' work if they do not want the existing fixed?
I am not fooled by smiling faces these days.

Pierre


Pierre Belarge
Re: That's no way to treat water #108076
06/06/04 03:59 PM
06/06/04 03:59 PM
P
PCBelarge  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 681
Dobbs Ferry, NY, USA
When I first started my business, I did do some work without a permit (no inspections). I really thought I was getting over on the unsuspecting building departments. As the years went by, I realized the only person who may benefit was the customer, and that is not always the case either. About 5 years ago I started filing all of my work, losing only a couple of small jobs as the customer did not want to file the work. I never felt like a thief in the night after that.

Pierre


Pierre Belarge
Re: That's no way to treat water #108077
06/06/04 04:45 PM
06/06/04 04:45 PM
I
iwire  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
North Attleboro, MA USA
Pierre I do not want to start something but I have to say I feel insulted.

Apparently I am a thief in the night, or have lost my integrity.

Walking away is not my choice, I do the job I am assigned.

Walking away when given the choice is the easy way out.

You know the expression "When life gives you lemons, make lemonade".

Well when I get handed a bad job I make the best of it, establish a relationship with the customer.

You guarantee nothing will change at this location if you do 'walk away'.


JMO, Bob


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
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