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Posted By: gfretwell Summary of systems around the world - 06/22/09 07:46 AM
This popped up on the home repair newsgroup and it looked interesting.
http://www.kropla.com/electric2.htm
Posted By: RODALCO Re: Summary of systems around the world - 06/22/09 09:27 PM
I have seen that list before too, very handy.
Thanks for providing the link again.
Regards, Raymond
Posted By: Texas_Ranger Re: Summary of systems around the world - 06/22/09 10:20 PM
Unfortunately www.global-electron.com, compiled by our fellow member C-H does not seem to be around any more. It was much more accurate and detailed.
Posted By: NORCAL Re: Summary of systems around the world - 06/23/09 02:28 PM
See this: http://www.global-electron.com/electricity.asp
Posted By: aussie240 Re: Summary of systems around the world - 06/25/09 02:50 AM
Interesting to see type "I" sockets spreading beyond their previous domain of the South Pacific...but used on 120V? I find that hard to believe. There's a list around claiming Fiji uses 220V at 60c/s...they make interesting reading but not always accurate.
Posted By: Texas_Ranger Re: Summary of systems around the world - 06/27/09 10:27 PM
NEMA 1-15 or 5-15 with 220 or 230V isn't much better and for example done in Thailand... I own a Super Nintendo power supply and a Sony compact stereo system, both of which are 220V 50Hz and have a molded NEMA 1-15 plug (the power supply is a 220V/9V Ac wall wart).

Regarding accuracy: no, they aren't, not even Global Electron, but IIRC C-H actually tried to contact the relevant authorities in each country to confirm his list. This did not work in all cases, but the list is a lot more reliable than the others. BEsides, it has more information.
Posted By: C-H Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/20/09 11:06 AM
I haven't updated the website in several years. Other things simply take too much time. But I still take the occasional photo of wiring I find interesting.

The past couple of days I've been staying in the workers dorm in a Soviet-era factory in Lithuania. Type C sockets most of the time, but also a Australian type socket marked with CCCP! I have a photo somewhere. The typical cable in walls was white zip-cord with solid conductors, possibly aluminium.

I opened the cover of a panel to see what the fuses looked like. It actually contained circuit breakers which looked to be original, probably from the 80's.

I should not forget a special feature: When you pulled a plug, most sockets followed... Handy when your cord is just a little too short or when you feel the urge for an energizing jolt. smile
Posted By: djk Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/20/09 12:45 PM
I wonder if the Australian type sockets were actually Chinese .... it would make more sense in the old Soviet days of the USSR.

Perhaps they were used as non-standard outlets to prevent accidental plugging-in of vacuum cleaners etc into some protected / switched circuit ?

We commonly use either keyed BS1363 plugs/sockets (standard) or BS546 for that purpose.
Posted By: Trumpy Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/21/09 11:34 AM
Originally Posted by djk
I wonder if the Australian type sockets were actually Chinese .... it would make more sense in the old Soviet days of the USSR.

Dave,
Could you please quantify/justify that comment?

The current configuration used in Australia, New Zealand, quite a few island nations of these two countries and also Argentina (that uses the same configuration, but it is inverted), was actually designed in Australia.

There is an Australian Standard that mandates the manufacture of this plug configuration (which escapes me at this point in time).

Posted By: djk Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/21/09 07:41 PM
Well, the USSR would have had a lot more trade connections with Communist China in the 1980s than it would have had with Australia or NZ.

I'd say it's more likely that a Chinese standard slipped into the Russian standards book as an alternative to their version of CEE 7 than an Aus/NZ plug.

China's been using a version of the Australian plug for quite some time. It's not absolutely identical, the pins on the Chinese version are slightly longer and the sockets are usually installed in the UK/IRL type configuration i.e. ground up.

Chinese:
[Linked Image from leadsdirect.co.uk]

Aus/NZ:
[Linked Image from zj-yunhuan.com]

The Chinese sockets also have the same layout as BS1363

Earth
Neutral Live

Giving them opposite polarity to Australia/NZ
Posted By: winston_1 Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/21/09 11:42 PM
BS 1363 has earth top, live bottom right, neutral bottom left. Aus/NZ has earth bottom, active top left, neutral top right which means if you turn it 180 degrees it is the same layout. Chinese sockets also have this layout. Argentina has active/neutral reversed.
Posted By: RODALCO Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/22/09 09:52 PM
Interesting to see these Chinese plugs.

I can see possible disasters happen when appliances inadvertendly get imported with these plugs and used in NZ with opposite polarity to the appliance.

or slip through the QC network with the correct NZ plug but polarity reversed.
Posted By: winston_1 Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/23/09 12:50 AM
As I explained above, they are NOT reversed. It is the Argentinian ones that are reversed.
Posted By: aussie240 Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/23/09 11:55 AM
Originally Posted by Trumpy
The current configuration used in Australia, New Zealand, quite a few island nations of these two countries and also Argentina (that uses the same configuration, but it is inverted), was actually designed in Australia.


Just to clarify this, the Australian plug is an obsolete U.S design; so old in fact it has no NEMA classification.
Apparently, it wasn't popular in the U.S because of incompatibility with the parallel pin plugs, hence it died out with NEMA 5-15 replacing it.
The Australian Standard version from 1937 has slightly shorter pins, with the earth pin slightly longer than the live and neutral (for obvious safety reasons). In practice this makes no difference and the plugs and sockets can be used with one another. I have a pre 1937 plug with all long pins; it fits perfectly in the modern socket.

Prior to 1937, Australia was using British round pin plugs ,the bayonet light socket, as well as the non earthed (NEMA 1-15) and the nameless 3 flat pin American designs. Clipsal still make the 2 flat parallel pin plug rated at 250V, not that it has been used in domestic applications for very long time. The ease of making flat pins as compared to round ones with the machines we had is why the American design was ultimately adopted here.

Literature I've seen indicates that NZ continued with British configurations for somewhat longer than AU did. I'd be interested to know more on NZ's adoption of the plug; was it just the "de facto 7th state of Oz" effect? Was it officially adopted at the same or a later time?

It is interesting to note that although our wall boxes and plug pattern are of American design, the wiring colour code, fuses, and light sockets stayed with British practice.

Argentina would most likely have taken the design from the U.S directly without any influence from Australia; especially given phase and neutral are reversed. It would be interesting to know how the sockets were wired in the U.S. and which adoptive country kept to the original standard. Given NEMA 5-15's pins are connected in the same order as ours, I suspect Argentina is the odd one out.

I would be interested to know how China came to use it, and when it started doing so. The Chinese power leads I've got have the cable leaving the side entry plug on the top side when plugged into an AU/NZ socket and the writing is upside down. They use the same connections.

Posted By: winston_1 Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/24/09 12:06 AM
Re China. When I was there about 5 years ago there were 2 sizes or crowsfoot plug/socket. The common one matched Australian plugs, but there was a larger version on the hotel air con which Australian plugs would not fit.

Re NZ. I read somewhere that BS1362 plugs were officially adopted but no one used them, instead using the Australian plugs.
Posted By: RODALCO Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/24/09 12:45 PM
The BS1363 sockets were still described with schematics in the revised edition 1987 of the handbook to the electrical wiring regulations 1976 under reg.50(e) and reg.100. in New Zealand
Posted By: Cn_HK Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/24/09 06:41 PM
Originally Posted by winston_1
Re China. When I was there about 5 years ago there were 2 sizes or crowsfoot plug/socket. The common one matched Australian plugs, but there was a larger version on the hotel air con which Australian plugs would not fit.
...

the latest chinese national standard in pdf format

GB1002-2008 Single phases plugs and socket-outlets for household and similar purposes — Types,basic parameters and dimensions
GB1003-2008 Three phases plugs and socket-outlets for household and similar purposes — Types,basic parameters and dimensions
Posted By: djk Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/25/09 12:51 PM
I don't quite understand why China's retaining the NEMA 110V style plugs for 220V.

Unless they're trying to have a multi-rated socket outlet system like the old British BS546 system where, you had 5amp outlets etc.

Surely it would make more sense to just implement a 2-pin crowfoot plug for small appliances and ditch the straight-pin version / phase it out.
Posted By: wa2ise Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/25/09 07:37 PM
Originally Posted by aussie240


Just to clarify this, the Australian plug is an obsolete U.S design; so old in fact it has no NEMA classification.
Apparently, it wasn't popular in the U.S because of incompatibility with the parallel pin plugs, hence it died out with NEMA 5-15 replacing it.



At my mom's house, we have a few of these providing 240VAC 60Hz 15 amp (no neutral, both angled pins are hot, and the ground is ground). [Linked Image from geocities.com] It provides power to a radio like this one: [Linked Image from geocities.com] Which doesn't mind it being 60Hz vs 50Hz.
Posted By: aussie240 Re: Summary of systems around the world - 07/26/09 11:46 AM
Originally Posted by wa2ise
It provides power to a radio like this one:

I don't know if you're aware of this, but those Calstan radios were made in the 1960's for use in schools. Calstan was a brand name used by Zenith (not affiliated with the U.S company of the same name). Their factory was in Sydney.
Radios like this are fine with 60c/s supply; the power transformers used in Australian valve radios are very conservatively rated.
Posted By: djk Re: Summary of systems around the world - 11/17/09 01:26 PM
The history of electrical systems in Ireland tends to go like this:

1800s-1927 : Lots of small urban supplies, run by independent companies or, quite often, by City Councils. Many of these systems were DC and from what I gather, plugs, sockets and fittings were generally British style i.e. BS546 and its predecessors. Very little evidence of these systems remains, so it's hard to know exactly what was used. Although, I strongly suspect that there were very few sockets in use, with many appliances being connected via a bayonet light socket. Although, you do find evidence of the odd very old remnants of a 2-pin British style socket hidden away somewhere.

In 1925, the first major Hydro-Electric station was built on the Shannon by Siemens and in 1927 ESB, the electricity supply board, was established with the objective of electrifying the entire country.

ESB was established as a corporation, but it was state-owned and had some rather serious powers to override local planning/development laws to run cables across private land etc. Its predecessors, and the telephone companies, and the Post Office Telegraphs/Telephones office could only run cables along public roads.

ESB began rolling out the national grid, which was initially operated at 110kV 50Hz and the major urban centres were hooked up to this and converted to 220V/380V 50Hz supplies.

This saw the introduction of German-style side-earthed plugs i.e. Schuko and Siemens diazed fuses.

However, Schuko type plugs were not used exclusively, and BS546 was also considered to be acceptable and continued to be used along side the continental style sockets (although usually not mixed in the same installation).

The only major difference was that the wiring rules were more like Germany than the UK, so BS546 and Schuko installations were wired pretty much the same way i.e. 15A BS546 sockets sat on 16A radial circuits and the smaller plug/sockets were generally not used.

The only exception to this seems to have been where the smaller plugs were used to connect radios in kitchens to a lighting circuit.

I've never seen much evidence of widespread us of the 5amp plugs that seem to have been quite common in the UK.

In the 1950s and 60s a mixture of both continued to be used, but BS546 was definitely gaining popularity possibly due to the ease of access to supplies of fittings, boxes etc.

BS1363 began to appear in a wide-spread way in the 1960s and for similar reasons to the UK, it was adopted as standard to wipe out the mess of standards which had been in use previously.

It also meant that we had a single system of socket in use across the Island of Ireland as Northern Ireland, being part of the UK was also adopting BS1363 at the same time.

So, that's basically the history of how we ended up with BS1363 laugh




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