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Foam in Boxes

Posted By: Admin

Foam in Boxes - 08/05/05 03:53 AM

(submitted by Joe Tedesco)
Quote
Hey Joe,


I thought you might like this picture of somebody's "clever" weatherstripping of a receptical. It was found in an apartment renovated a few years ago under a permit! Not too sure how this got slipped past inspection, but all of the recepticals on the outer walls are just like this.

I took this picture myself and you may use it for anything you want.

-Joey
[Linked Image]
Posted By: Radar

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/05/05 06:21 PM

Kinda wrecks the old box fill calculations, don't it.
Posted By: alan bergold

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/05/05 08:03 PM

how do we calculate foam into box fill calculations?
Posted By: electure

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/05/05 10:21 PM

Easy [Linked Image]

4 x 4 x 1-1/2 Box = 21 cu in per 314.16 (A)

3 #12 conductor @ 2.25 cu in each = 6.75 cu in.

1 device @ 2 x 2.25 cu in = 4.5 cu in

1 Foam job @ 9.75 cu in

Perfect fit [Linked Image]
Posted By: sierra electrician

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/05/05 11:32 PM

4 x 4 x 1-1/2 Box = 21 cu in per 314.16 (A)

3 #12 conductor @ 2.25 cu in each = 6.75 cu in.

1 device @ 2 x 2.25 cu in = 4.5 cu in

1 Foam job @ 9.75 cu in
_________________________________________________

= 0.00 cu in + Fire Hazzard x (10)2 = Complete Violation & Installer must be shot.
Posted By: mxslick

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/06/05 02:28 AM

But it keeps the recept. and terminals at a constant toasty temperature....what's the problem? [Linked Image]

And it eliminates that annoying loose device wiggle, too.

Constantly amazes me how dumb some people can be...
Posted By: Trumpy

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/07/05 11:02 AM

Boy!,
I bet that was hard to get out!.
What's more concerning, is the stuff that Expanding foam is made out of.
Posted By: techie

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/07/05 01:19 PM

I see what looking like pink fiberglass insulation the the lower corner of the box.. is there actually a box there? or just a mud ring?
Posted By: Theelectrikid

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/07/05 09:45 PM

"I see what looking like pink fiberglass insulation the the lower corner of the box.. is there actually a box there? or just a mud ring?"

Is there even a box here? [Linked Image]

[This message has been edited by Theelectrikid (edited 08-07-2005).]
Posted By: jdadamo

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/08/05 12:58 AM

Yes there is a box there. You will notice that the insulation is actually on the outside of the mudring. What I'm wondering now is where the vapor barrier is. I wonder if somebody stuffed that in there at a later point to plug a leak. It looks like weatherstripping was a huge concern back when this place was renovated.

The reason there is a mudring is because the property is piped and most common pipe installs here use 4x4 boxes with mudrings. There are a few single-gang-with-knockout style boxes, but those are usually at the end of switch loops and only contain two #14s.

Don't let the lack of paint on the receptacle throw you off much either as the maintenance guy of the apartment was not in the habit of removing plates to paint. Almost every plate has a small ring of paint around it. That install has been there, foam and all, I would guess, about five years.

It is unknown to me if the other 166 suites in the building are identical with respect to foaming receptacles on outside walls. I assume so. Some of the suite designs that were missing receptacles in certain places (12 foot rule) had them added using wiremold, so whatever work was done, it obviously had to be made to conform to code at the time of renovation.

I should show you guys a very interesting install that I also snapped a picture of from the same complex. One type of suite had a bedroom receptacle directly behind the fridge, and that recept and the fridge recept were in a single box with a mudring on each side. With both plates off you can look through into the other room! Never, ever seen anything like that before but it was clearly original.

Honestly, aside from the foam, i'd say the wiring as a whole is actually pretty good. All of the devices are P&S, not back-stabbed, etc. Not your standard corner cutting, 35 cent, back stabbed, home depot special--which is much more common.

[This message has been edited by jdadamo (edited 08-07-2005).]
Posted By: BElder

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/10/05 05:38 PM

You know that this was done after rough inspection. so how would the inspector even see this at final w/out pulling cover plates? I personally don't have time or maybe it's time to tell the EC's to leave them off to check for proper gropunding of switches and recepts anyway.
NOTE: that if this was done w/permit it should have been a licensed EC.
Thank you Contractor license Schools For Giving Anyone w/a $1000.00 a Contractors licenes [Linked Image]
Posted By: electure

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/11/05 11:18 AM

Brian,
We should also thank the jurisdictions that don't give any time to their inspectors, and hire carpenters to inspect electrical work.
Posted By: Theelectrikid

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/19/05 03:11 PM

Okay I see the box now. Yeah I must agree, at least the recept isn't a 35cent backstab special. Box fill? This box is full!
Ian A.
Posted By: Hazmat

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/19/05 04:07 PM

You all assume the EC did this...I guess I'd be more likely to figure it was the "handyman" who got tired of tentants complaining of drafts around the recep's and figure he just fix the problem...them $0.04 foam gaskets are just too expensive.
Posted By: Elviscat

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/19/05 07:10 PM

one of the best things about an all pipe install is that new circuits can be pulled in easily and old wires can be replaced without tearing up walls, and it'd probably take half an hour to dig all this foam out of the box/conduit at each location without damaging the wires

Joey-
about the box with the fridge/bedroom recepticals, is there a box that comes open on each end to allow this kind of thing? the only way I could think of doing something like that is bolting two bog extensions together...
Posted By: electure

Re: Foam in Boxes - 08/20/05 01:03 AM

Maybe something like this?


[Linked Image]

This is a Bowers throughbox. They've been around for ages
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