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Posted By: Admin EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/06/05 09:49 PM
Quote
On a visit to the house of a successful resturaunteur, I couldn't help but notice the wiring of his outdoor lights on his "McMansion." In this case, I think the running of the Romex in the pipe was a blessing....

Please note in one pic the sharp right-angle bend in the EMT- sure looks nice! There are two violations here- name them! (Plus others in the pic also).

The next pic- please forgive the grainieness of the enlargement- shows the type of "coupling" used several times to connect two pieces of EMT.

- renosteinke
[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[This message has been edited by Webmaster (edited 07-06-2005).]
Posted By: John Crighton Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/06/05 11:59 PM
The two violations:

1. Insufficient EMT bend radius.
2. Conduit installation likely not completed prior to installation of wires.

And at least five, and maybe seven more in the upper photo:

3. Improper connector at box (not for EMT).
4. Exposed wires to lighting fixture.
5. Lighting fixture not listed for direct surface mounting.
6. Insufficient NM bend radius (into hole in soffit).
7. NM not secured within 12" of box.

If this is considered a wet location:

8. NM not allowed in wet location.
9. Non-weathertight box in wet location.

Did I miss anything?
Posted By: renosteinke Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/07/05 02:31 AM
Good eyes, John! FWIW, I was so focused on the bend I failed to notice the way the pipe was connected to the box :-(

I'm not sure about the "flush mounting" issue; there sure are a lot of lights mounted around here where the wire simply pokes through a hole in the wall; the space in the fixture is your only "box."

Being directly under the eave, as I was taught, would make this a "damp", rather than "wet" location. I was taught to imagine a 45 degree angle from the edge of the overhang to the wall or ground....inside this area was "damp." I can't document this "rule" though- maybe someone else can?
Posted By: Trumpy Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/07/05 11:58 PM
Hmm,
I would say that that metal box isn't going to last long the way that it is installed.
Air-borne moisture will see to that.
That bend (if you can call it that) is a real beauty. [Linked Image]
Exactly what sort of a saddle is that in the bottom picture?.
I'd have to go along with Reno here on the "surface-mounting" issue, we have a lot of exact same sensor-light units here that merely screw to the soffit of the house (into timber, of course).
One other thing, has the sensor unit on this fitting been mounted upside-down?
Reason I say that, is because the Time/Lux controls should be pointing downward, or is the black thing on the sensor there a slide switch?
Posted By: renosteinke Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/08/05 01:45 AM
The sensor is oriented correctly..the black thing is a slide switch, and, if you have a good screen, you can barely see to the right of it a white dial that adjusts the sensitivity.

As for the "coupling:" I had never seen this fitting before. My best guess is that it is used to join EMT to MC cable. The "saddle" being the part that clamps on the MC.
Posted By: electure Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/08/05 03:20 AM
I've never seen the coupling shown either, but:

[Linked Image]

Here's a Regal brand 1/2" EMT x 3/8"flex coupling. Maybe???
Posted By: Hemingray Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/08/05 07:13 AM
that installation to the light is missing a ground too.
Posted By: Trumpy Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/08/05 10:08 AM
Hemingray,
Quote
that installation to the light is missing a ground too.
I do believe that them fittings are Double Insulated, No Earth Required. [Linked Image]
Posted By: frank Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/08/05 11:48 AM
We call that a BX to EMT connector.For running in drop ceilings.We install it just above the t-bars to transition to emt for surface mount switches,receptacles.usually it's AC90 to emt though.Saves time and space

[This message has been edited by frank (edited 07-08-2005).]
Posted By: tkb Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/08/05 02:51 PM
quote by frank:
We call that a BX to EMT connector.For running in drop ceilings.We install it just above the t-bars to transition to emt for surface mount switches,receptacles.usually it's AC90 to emt though.Saves time and space
------------------------------------

I don't think that you could use this fitting for BX (AC) or for MC cable since it does not have the retainer for the antishort. I believe that it only listed for 3/8" flex to EMT.
Posted By: SolarPowered Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/08/05 04:10 PM
Are the conductors in AC and/or MC marked? I've seen many mentions of folks wanting to strip the jacket off Romex and run the wires through conduit, which idea is nixed because the conductors aren't marked. Is the situation different with AC and MC? Otherwise, I don't see how one could use this fitting to transition from AC/MC to EMT.

EMT to 3/8" flex makes sense, though, to continue a THHN run into a motor whip, etc.
Posted By: John Crighton Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/08/05 06:54 PM
Yup, I completely missed the "fixture is not grounded" violation!

I'll accept that it's a "damp" location. I'd still want a weathertight box.

As to surface mounting that fixture to siding or timber: It's OK for the entire back of the "junction box" formed by the fixture base to be combustible? I mean, I'm sure it's done a thousand times a day, but is it a "correct" wiring method?

I have a theory: The installer intended to mount the light fixture on the box, but after he got it mounted and the conduit and Romex attached, he noticed that the screw holes were on the wrong diagonal (look at the fixture base). Instead of re-doing the box, he just screwed the fixture to the soffit, put a blank cover on the box, and said, "Yeah, I meant to do it that way."
Posted By: renosteinke Re: EMT- Neat Look, but WRONG - 07/08/05 08:44 PM
Who ever really knows what went through the mind of a hack worker?

The fixture might not have a ground lead; many such fixtures are entirely made of plastic.

Technical rules aside, I'd also like to see a weathertight box- too many times I've found standard boxes infested with spiders or wasps. Really annoying to try to take the cover off- and see multiple little legs pulling back :-)
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