Unused extension cords should have been removed after the last convention show back in 1980!

[This message has been edited by Joe Tedesco (edited 02-04-2003).]

Here in Reno such work is not done by electricians, but be the "stage technicians" union. Does anyone know anything about their apprenticeship, etc?

if in fact, they are disconnected from a source of power they are removed as an electrical hazard (or anything else)


right?

The International Association of Theatrical Stage Electricians (IATSE) apprenticeship program varies from local chapter to local chapter. There is a movement underway to have an industry governing body (probably Entertainment Services & Technology Association, ESTA) to establish a compentency rating system to deal with the lack of personnel certification standards across the industry. They are discussing a certification for electricians, riggers, and a core program for general technicians. One of the problems right now is that IATSE serves theatre, convention, rigging, makeup, costumes, props, film, television, pyrotechnics, truckloading... (you get the idea) depending on the different cities that the local covers.

Mike:

So you are saying that those who work in these areas are not even licensed electricians who are familiar with the hazards involved, according to the definition of a "Qualified Person" in the 2002 NEC - right?

Qualified Person. One who has skills and knowledge related to the construction and operation of the electrical equipment and installations and has received safety training on the hazards involved.

sparky: I still would ask that the cords be removed because IF they were connected to an outlet then the story is the same story -- it can lead to an electrocution!!

'IF' would require a 'qualified person', thus no hazard.

Oldest story in the book
Question is who pays for the work to fix this kind of junk?
If the owner does not want to pay - who is going to work for free?

I see the ends of the wires have turned a nice shade of green. Is there a lot of moisture up there? Must be a leak or something. The strain reliefs are also all rusted.

Joe,
You are somewhat correct about licensure. IATSE electricians are not required to be licensed IBEW electricians, but certainly can be. This is why there are some convention spaces here in Las Vegas will only use IBEW electricians to drop power to a client on the floor and then the IATSE or client people will then simply plug it in and turn on the switch.
I would say that the majority of IATSE electricians are qualified personnel, but are qualified for the scope of work that they encounter on a daily basis. Depending on the electrician they would be quite familiar with the NEC articles 518 to 540 which deal specifically with the industry.
Another thing to remember is that the products that are listed for use by these electricians are designed to be of a "Extra Heavy Duty Type" and isn't installed for very long of a time. The infrastructure and permanent equipment and wiring is still being installed by IBEW electricians. The temporary products are generally used as per the manufacturers instructions and according to the NEC.
As indicated by this picture, though, there are some unqualified people out there using equipment and wiring methods not allowed in particular applications. There are also those who have almost no clue what they're doing (i.e. non-electricians). I believe that this is apparent, in different degrees, in any industry. The ESTA Certification is attempting to help shrink this hole. I think all of us here take great pride in making our work neat, clean, and safe, but there are those "electricians" out there who don't as we have seen in a few of the photos here.
Qualified and Licensed are unfortunately not synonomous.

Sigh. I see this every day. Most people and companies hire electricians to install hard wired appliances or expand circuits. Very few call an electrician when it comes to removing appliances or removing part of a circuit. Usually, the power is just cut by taking the fuse(s) out and cut the cable. At some point later the circuit is energized by someone replacing fuses in an attempt to get some other circuit to work. There's half a dozen live or maybe live cut cables hanging in our office room, similar to Joe's picture. The problem is worsened by the fact that the wiring is surface mounted or placed on "ladders". When a wall is removed or added, junction boxes are left hanging in mid air. From what I read here, Americans have more respect for electrical wiring.

[This message has been edited by C-H (edited 02-05-2003).]

Not quite....



There's something like this in the little bathroom in the laundry room in my apartment building.

There's a porcelain lampholder/fixture in the ceiling.

A screw-in plug adapter was inserted into the socket and a zip cord extension was draped across some pipes and terminated into a porcelain lampholder of the type used in table lamps and ceiling fans. You know the one with the little metal hickey and the exposed terminals!

The reasoning was it makes the bulb easier to change without needing a ladder. The ceiling is about 15 feet high in there!!

At least Joe T.'s picture shows an enclosed phenolic lampholder in place. Although it seems like it got shattered and wrapped in tape...

[This message has been edited by SvenNYC (edited 02-05-2003).]

Mike:

Your comments add a valuable contribution to the subject of this thread.

We will look into the possibilities related to their training needs.

Why I have over 200 pictures of this convention center that I could show them!

Do you think that would work, or would they be offended like most are when these situations are brought to light?

Anyone interested in a field trip in their city?

I'll be in San Diego and Phoenix soon -- great places for street violations for sure!!

I would think that they would be open to cleaning up their act. Because of all of the space and people involved in a convention center the steward may not even know this situation exists. Look up the local IATSE hall when you are there next and offer a little constructive criticism. I would think that they take pride in their work and are willing to take criticism. I know I am...

Many of the cords in this parking structure were energized.




[This message has been edited by electure (edited 02-08-2003).]

And here's what the tree wiring looked like for ???

[This message has been edited by Joe Tedesco (edited 02-10-2003).]

You sure that's not one of those "stealth" antennas???

That's probably true!

I will revise my comments above.

The question is then would the cord wiring be acceptable and does the NEC cover this? The PVC is only schedule 40.

Mike- I want to thank you for your input.
There is a lot of ground covered with the words "electrical work." Much of this work is done by trades other than electricians. I, for one, would like to see some more cross-training; it would be very nice if the various unions would begin by recognising each other! If nothing else, those of us in the trade would benifit by understanding the practices of the others!

John, so true and in the LA area there are many wannaee electricians!

I sure hope they too will begin to learn more about the NEC and electrical safety.