ECN Forum
Posted By: scameron81 oxygen free copper - 03/04/07 02:30 AM
Can anyone enlighten me on what the story is behind "oxygen free" speaker cable? It seems like a marketing scam to me.
Posted By: renosteinke Re: oxygen free copper - 03/04/07 02:39 AM
"Oxygen free copper" is a form of copper, nearly pure, that is used for wires. No other form, AFAIK, is used for electrical wires.

It does differ from 'simple' copper; I can attest that it is noticeably harder to machine than other forms of copper.

Also, AFAIK, this level of purity is difficult to achieve in recycling, so wire is made from "virgin" copper ore only.
Posted By: e57 Re: oxygen free copper - 03/04/07 08:55 AM
Unless you are sending a man or a woman to the Moon or Mars I really don't think it matters. Oh wait, unless it is in the job spec's and they are willing to pay too.

Otherwise, for general building wire, or all but sensitive medical equipment - no it doesn't matter.
Posted By: NJwirenut Re: oxygen free copper - 03/04/07 04:14 PM
Reno's right. Essentially ALL electrical wire is made from OFHC (Oxygen free, High conductivity) copper. Also called "Alloy 10100". Minimum 99.99% Cu.

The "oxygen free" terminology applied to audio cables is just marketing hype. An ordinary piece of zip cord is made from the same type of copper as the megabuck audio cables are.
Posted By: Scott35 Re: oxygen free copper - 03/08/07 10:59 PM
Regarding the Oxygen-Free Copper Conductors used for Audio Equipment…

Does anyone know of any independent studies (as in non-biased type of study), where through a Double-Blind process, the validity of claims towards Oxygen-Free Copper's Sound perception has been proven, or disproved?

What seems peculiar to me is that I haven't noticed too much attention placed on the use of OFHC for Patch Cords - or anything in the "Preamp" or "Line Level" areas; only in the Loudspeaker Connection areas - excluding the use of OFHC for Voice Coils, Leads, Crossover Components, and Terminals.
Seems that these would be the more crucial areas to use the Megabuck Copper.
I may not had noticed any references, probably since the entire issue is $$$ oriented to me, so it becomes unnoticed!

I have heard some Audiophiles claim that OFHC Speaker Wire does make a noticeable difference in the complete sound package.
On the flip side, these same Audiophiles purchase Hubbell 5362 Receptacles for $180.00 each, so describes the Quagmire I am facing!

Scott35
Posted By: BuildingHomes Re: oxygen free copper - 03/08/07 11:11 PM
I recall reading somewhere about what oxygene free really meant (removal of iron or something from the mix)

It may have been at AudioHolics. These guys are sometimes insane with their details.
http://www.audioholics.com/education/cables

This guy is also a pretty good read:
http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm
Posted By: hbiss Re: oxygen free copper - 03/08/07 11:21 PM
Does anyone know of any independent studies (as in non-biased type of study), where through a Double-Blind process, the validity of claims towards Oxygen-Free Copper's Sound perception has been proven, or disproved?

Non-biased double blind study? Absolutely. This is done all the time with much of the audiophile snake oil that's out there. Just look at the ads. Seems the results are directly related to whoever sponsors the test however.

-Hal
Posted By: techie Re: oxygen free copper - 03/09/07 12:37 AM
I can't point to any specifics, but I have heard of numerous tests being done by audio professionals, using ears, and test equipment that show that the "oxygen free" speaker cables are in fact snake oil..

The results showed that there was no measurable difference between the "oxygen free" cables, and COTS cable of the same gauge.

I think "oxygen free" refers to the braincells of any person who actually believes the snake oil salesman.

Personally, I'm happy with any appropriately sized cable from Belden, West-Penn, etc..

For portable cabling, SJ/SJO types work just fine. If you're wiring your bookshelf speakers, a roll of zipcord works just fine.
Posted By: Tesla Re: oxygen free copper - 04/22/07 07:46 PM
'Oxygen free' is a necessary condition to draw copper into wire. If it's an electrically conducting copper wire it's by definition ALWAYS oxygen free.

Copper ore is crushed, floated and reduced to crude plates. These are then electrolically replated producing high purity metal. This must be further processed to get rid of the oxygen impurities left in by the plating process. After this the copper is sold as 'WIRE BAR' ie extrudable/drawable copper suitable for conductor usage. Wire bar is a quoted commodity and is the feed stock for Belden et al.
Posted By: Alan Belson Re: oxygen free copper - 04/24/07 09:32 PM
Copper is refined electrolytically in a bath of acidulated copper sulphate solution by deposition on a cathode and is easily produced 99.96 to 99.99% pure. American copper contains about 110oz of silver and 1/2oz of gold per ton, which are collected as 'anode slime' with other metals. Other impurities dissolve as sulphates in the electrolyte.
Anode, 'poled' touch-pitch copper, before electrolysis, contains between 0.02% and 0.04% oxygen. This small amount is necessary to strike a balance with cuprous oxide, Cu2O , which renders the melt brittle but is part of the refining process to remove iron as a slag. Electrolysis may reduce oxygen levels further, but the common commercially produced metal, as drawn into wire, is essentially very pure indeed and virtually oxygen free. Yep, it's snake oil.

Posted By: Alan Belson Re: oxygen free copper - 04/24/07 10:43 PM
As an afterthought, iron, nickel, arsenic, cobalt and zinc dissolve as sulphates, while the platinum metals, with selenium, tellurium, lead, bismuth, tin and antimony deposit in the anode slime with the gold and silver. So on the face of it, copper scrap can be reprocessed to produce electrical quality copper.

Posted By: RODALCO Re: oxygen free copper - 04/26/07 11:08 AM
That name is just a marketting hype AFAIC.
As already said Overpriced speaker cables. waste of money.

Just use normal Cu flex cable, even TPS will do.
I use 4 mm² TPS on my stereo system which works fine.

Ok i have no oxygen coated ears either laugh

A multi stranded conductor is probably better than a 7 stranded conductor, because on higher frequencies the skin effect becomes more paramount.
As long Copper is used i can't see any difference here.
Posted By: JuddsAirco Re: oxygen free copper - 05/28/08 05:06 PM
http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/auc_ch.pl?charity&1109596809&view
Posted By: twh Re: oxygen free copper - 05/29/08 02:53 AM
Originally Posted by http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/auc_ch.pl?charity&1109596809&view
After about 150 hours of break in, you ears will thank you.

What happens after 150 hours?
Posted By: JuddsAirco Re: oxygen free copper - 05/30/08 04:50 AM
You have to give it break in time for the molecules in the contacts to become properly aligned for superb power flow to the equipment.
Posted By: hbiss Re: oxygen free copper - 05/31/08 01:06 AM
Deep cryo my butt! What do you want to bet none of that stuff ever sees anything lower than room temperature. You think those weasels are going to spend money for liquid nitrogen and containers? Who would ever know the difference?

-Hal
Posted By: EV607797 Re: oxygen free copper - 05/31/08 10:36 PM
Yep, these are likely the same people who have managed to convince the world that CAT5e cable is going to make phone conversations sound better on a standard (POTS) phone line. I challenge anyone on this planet to prove this.
Posted By: brianl703 Re: oxygen free copper - 06/04/08 08:19 PM
If the other cable is "quad" and there are two lines involved, I have no doubt that Cat5E would sound better by preventing crosstalk.

But then so would Cat3 or, hell, AT&T DIW.
Posted By: mikesh Re: oxygen free copper - 06/10/08 04:58 PM
Lets see the Audio phile has probably lost some of their hearing just like most adults. Audiophiles will spend $3000 to $5000 for a power distribution panel that is a standard home service panel from Europe with the neutral and ground buss made from a big block of copper and gold plated. Even at retail you could purchase the panel and plate the bus with gold for less than $1000. They spend $300 for hdmi cables made by Monster for digital signals. They buy analogue records, made from digital masters because they sound purer yet completely avoid the same recording if offered at the same quality as the Digital master. Even if they have equipment that samples at the same level as those analogue records made from digital.
Don't even get me going on $5000 cd players. I stopped being and Audiophile after my 3rd or forth rock concert or maybe it was the construction. I know I can't hear 20 to 20khz any more and there are a few frequencies in the middle I don't hear too well any more.
BTW I love buying that real nice loom for auto wiring and covering my $20 HDMI cables and calling them Monster killers ;-)
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