Here is a question. How close can a receptacle get to the shower/tub area before it is a violation? A foot? 3 feet? 18" Any thoughts? You know that I am going somewhere with this question. I would like to hear some answers first before I bring out the problem I am hearing. Thanks for any answer.

A strict reading of the code says it can't be in "tub space". As long as it is outside the shower curtain it is "hold your nose" legal. Good design would put it where water is unlikely to splash on it. These days a nuisance trip of the GFCI is the most likely problem.

Try 406.8(C)2005 N.E.C.

Greg,


As usual you are on target with what I am thinking. I will give it another day or two before I say what is on my mind.

As long as it is outside the footprint you are OK code-wise.

Doesn't do much to stop you from plugging in the TV and setting it on the tub ledge tho. I know that hard and fast distances might be hard to achieve in a small bath but there should be a better way.

We put GFCIs in places like this and just hope they do the job when people are stupid.

Outside of the tub 'footprint' is all I can enforce.

Harold...are you aiming for the flat screen TV issue??

As far for tub footprint anything outside of the " boundary line " is fine but if someone really serious about putting a flat tv in the bathtub area one way you can make is safe is breech a opening behind the wall and put in marine grade plexglass and install the flat tv behind I know someone did that allready.

Myself I did not see that setup so hard to say if that did pass with flying colours or Drapeau rouge {red flag} show up.

Merci,Marc

re plexiglass
France may have some great water, after all you invented bottling it but in most places I would use tempered glass so you could keep it clean.

I am going where Greg is talking about. What is the tub space? What does 406.8(C) really say? "Receptacles shall not be installed within or directly over a bathtub or shower area." Does sec. 410.4 (which defines a shower area) refer to the shower area? Does it mean a receptacle can't be within 3' of the tub/shower edge?

I have seen many times where someone puts a TV in the bathroom but forgets to make the receptacle a GFI protected one. So they fail that job, but can you fail someone for having a receptacle within 3' of the tub? What is the code section?

Now Harold that will raise a very good point related to the receptale near the bathtub I feel it almost like designing issue if this bathroom is small there is not much we can do beside follow the NEC requirement.

Greg., Yeah France have alot of nice body of water allover the place however with the French Electrical code it is very strict and I mean far much stricter than NEC is the old regualations will NOT allow any receptale unless you have isolation transfomer AKA shaver tranformer now that slowly going out of flavour now allowed have RCD protected receptale but only in " zone 3 " I will try to find a diagram what it layout look like and the first metre { apx 3 feet } no recpectale in that location from bathtub or shower stall. that we called zone 0 or 1 depending on the setup the zone 2 can have switches but limited used receptale the zone 3 anything can go from there so each zone is expaned per meter apart it will change zone.

Merci,Marc

I sit on a board that hears complaints between the contractor and the AHJ. In this case the AHJ does not want the receptacle to be within 2" of the tub/shower area. ( From what I hear.) I haven't sat on the case yet, but I hear what is going down through the grapevine. Anyway, if you agree or do not agree with the AHJ, about a receptacle within 2' of the tub/shower area, Is there a code section that he can cite? Is there something in the code that says a "Receptacle can not be within X" of the tub?" If so, let me know what that section is. I would need a chapter and verse that says that so that the AHJ can "hang his hat" on. OR is the contractor right. There isn't a code section that says how far a "RECEPTACLE", can be from the shower/tub area. There are sections in the NEC which talks about fans, pendant lights, etc.

Any thoughts?

Whether 2 inches or 2 feet, the AHJ is making it up as he goes along. Perhaps he infers this from some other standard, pr he is allowing for a standard tub to be placed where an undersize one now sits - in any event, it's up to him to make his case.

The contractor, OTOH, has no need to justify his position. Absent a code citation, he's in compliance. It's up to the AHJ to show otherwise.

Why 2 feet? don't standard appliances come with a 6 foot cord? it will only fall 4 feet into the tub at that point. if there is no receptacle present and the homeowner wants their precious flat screen tv while in the tub, they will probably run a zip cord type extension cord to the nearest receptacle. that being said you may as well give them the proper gfci receptacle. I'm kinda liking the glass idea brought up by Marc...however the nec is not a design tool right? maybe in the future bathrooms will have some type of dry compartment within the foot print to contain the tv and all associated wiring maybe the building codes will have something to say on this ?

The way that i look at it.
90.4 clearly says that the AHJ has the final interpretation of the code.
I do understand that sometimes they (AHJ) and the code does not make sense but you have to follow it. Unless it is absolutely nonsense, which may be the case now.

Ed,


Most times the EC will usually do what the AHJ wants because it is not a big deal. It doesn't cost us much to move a receptacle over 1 foot. That is when the wall is open. Now once that wall gets closed up, gets tile or marble over it, now try to move that receptacle over 1 foot. Then it becomes a very big deal. The argument now opens up to, "Why wasn't it caught on the rough?" That would be the big question. Yet on "rough" inspections, a lot can happen between a rough and a final. Like different installers, the HO changes their mind, or gets a different appliance. So when the AHj comes back on the final, it might look "wrong" to the AHJ. Now what?