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Length of service cables inside

Posted By: giddonah

Length of service cables inside - 08/04/06 02:56 PM

Is there any code reference as to how far away a panel can be from where the service cables enter a house? I believe it should be as close as possible to where the cables enter, but what about a utility room in the middle of a house, 12' away from an exterior wall?
Posted By: gfretwell

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/04/06 03:09 PM

It is not specified. The AHJ makes that call. Read the comment after 230.70 in the handbook for more on this but it basically says the same thing.
Posted By: Alan Nadon

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/04/06 03:11 PM

12 foot seems to be a violation.
Basic rule is in 230.70 also check 230.6
Alan--
Posted By: giddonah

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/04/06 03:18 PM

I thought I had read something about it, but didn't find it (went right by that page too). Thanks guys.
Posted By: tdhorne

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/04/06 04:01 PM

What wiring method is used for the Service Entrance Conductors? The conductors can come up through the floor if the Utility Room is in the basement but I don't imagine you would have brought this up if that were the case. Type USE conductors may not extend more than six feet inside a structure because they lack a flame retardant outer covering. If the service entry conductors would have to extend twenty feet into a building and you can't encase them in masonry at least two inches thick on all sides you will have to resort to an exterior Service Disconnecting Means. Alternatively you could mount the main breaker in a flush mount enclosure at any acceptable place just inside the structure. Your main panel then becomes a feeder supplied panel and all of the rules that apply to what everyone calls "sub panels" now apply. If this doesn't actually fit your situation then sketch in some more detail and I'll try again.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous for general use." Thomas Alva Edison

PS That is what I get for interupting my reply composing to have an involved conversation. The other replies make mine late and perhaps silly.

[This message has been edited by tdhorne (edited 08-04-2006).]
Posted By: ShockMe77

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/04/06 10:05 PM

I'm thinking a main breaker disconnect should be installed at the "nearest point of entrance" (or outside) and then put the panel wherever you want, except for a bathroom or kitchen.
Posted By: Celtic

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/04/06 10:59 PM

Why not a kitchen?
Posted By: HotLine1

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/04/06 11:41 PM

Tom:
I'm curious as to where you obtained this info
"Type USE conductors may not extend more than six feet inside a structure because they lack a flame retardant outer covering."

Basically 'closest from point of entry into panel'; literally meaning...out of meter pan, into basement, and straight into panel' No turns, straight down into panel. That's the basic.

John
Posted By: HotLine1

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/04/06 11:44 PM

Shock: (Ron)

I have to go with Celtic, what do you mean 'not in kitchen'.

What would be wrong (Code wise, not design) with a panel in a kitchen wall??

John
Posted By: trobb

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/05/06 10:04 PM

Actually, in a home of a friend they took out the utility room, moved the water heater to a closet off the kitchen, and ended up with the panel right there next to the back door... in the kitchen (it never was moved). AHJ passed it, no changes needed.
Posted By: Tom

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/06/06 12:33 PM

In the 2002 NEC, USE was allowed to be run indoors a maximum of 6 feet.

" The length of the cable extending indoors to the first termination box shall not exceed 1.8 m (6 ft). " 338.10(B)(4)(b)

This language has been deleted in the 2005 edition. If the cable is not dual rated, such as USE/RHW, then it cannot be used indoors if the 2005 NEC is being enforced.

Tom
Posted By: gfretwell

Re: Length of service cables inside - 08/06/06 06:27 PM

The only problem I see with panels in the kitchen is you will probably have a working space problem. Wall space in the kitchen is at a premium and you need clear space around a panel.

Could you put it behind the refrigerator?
;-)
They are usually on wheels.
As bad as that sounds it might be the easiest way to insure you maintain the clear space. An issue might be "foreign systems", depending on how the icemaker is plumbed.
In retrospect I would also question "readily accessible" but you usually have that problem, wherever the panel gets installed. How many times have you been able to walk right up to a residential panel in an occupied home and have full working space without moving something?
I put mine in a shallow closet with little room for any other use (except my wiring) just for that reason.
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