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Posted By: Tom H Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/23/06 04:52 PM
I found this on another forum i belong to and thought everyone would enjoy.

Merry Christmas to those who celebrate.

Tom


Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective
I. There are approximately two billion children (persons under 18) in the world. However, since Santa does not visit children of Muslim, Hindu, Jewish or Buddhist religions, this reduces the workload for Christmas night to 15% of the total, or 378 million (according to the Population Reference Bureau).

At an average (census) rate of 3.5 children per house hold, that comes to 108 million homes, presuming that there is at least one good child in each.

II. Santa has about 31 hours of Christmas to work with, thanks to the different time zones and the rotation of the earth, assuming he travels east to west (which seems logical). This works out to 967.7 visits per second. This is to say that for each Christian household with a good child, Santa has around 1/1000th of a second to park the sleigh, hop out, jump down the chimney, fill the stockings, distribute the remaining presents under the tree, eat whatever snacks have been left for him, get back up the chimney, jump into the sleigh and get on to the next house.

Assuming that each of these 108 million stops is evenly distributed around the earth (which, of course, we know to be false, but will accept for the purposes of our calculations), we are now talking about 0.78 miles per household; a total trip of 75.5 million miles, not counting bathroom stops or breaks. This means Santa's sleigh is moving at 650 miles per second --- 3,000 times the speed of sound. For purposes of comparison, the fastest man-made vehicle, the Ulysses space probe, moves at a poky 27.4 miles per second, and a conventional reindeer can run (at best) 15 miles per hour.

III. The payload of the sleigh adds another interesting element. Assuming that each child gets nothing more than a medium sized Lego set (two pounds), the sleigh is carrying over 500 thousand tons, not counting Santa himself. On land, a conventional reindeer can pull no more than 300 pounds. Even granting that the "flying" reindeer could pull ten times the normal amount, the job can't be done with eight or even nine of them--- Santa would need 360,000 of them. This increases the payload, not counting the weight of the sleigh, another 54,000 tons, or roughly seven times the weight of the Queen Elizabeth (the ship, not the monarch).

IV. 600,000 tons traveling at 650 miles per second creates enormous air resistance --- this would heat up the reindeer in the same fashion as a spacecraft re-entering the earth's atmosphere. The lead pair of reindeer would absorb 14.3 quintillion joules of energy per second each. In short, they would burst into flames almost instantaneously, exposing the reindeer behind them and creating deafening sonic booms in their wake.

The entire reindeer team would be vaporized within 4.26 thousandths of a second, or right about the time Santa reached the fifth house on his trip.

Not that it matters, however, since Santa, as a result of accellerating from a dead stop to 650 m.p.s. in .001 seconds, would be subjected to centrifugal forces of 17,500 g's. A 250 pound Santa (which seems ludicrously slim) would be pinned to the back of the sleigh by 4,315,015 pounds of force, instantly crushing his bones and organs and reducing him to a quivering blob of pink goo.

Therefore, if Santa did exist, he's dead now.
http://www.engineeringedu.com/Santa.html
Posted By: iwire Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/23/06 04:56 PM
It figures an engineer could not figure this out. [Linked Image]

DUH!

Santa is magical.
That's why children tell Santa what they want instead of engineers. What kid wants a drawing of a toy with a PE stamp on it and "30% complete" in the lower right corner?
Joe
Posted By: LK Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/23/06 06:32 PM
The way i see it, Santa's sleigh would make a great service truck, and Santa would be a great service tech.
Posted By: HotLine1 Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/23/06 06:50 PM
OK, the only thing that seems to be missing is the usual disclaimer 'subject to field verification by contractor'

Merry Christmas, & may Santa reign!!

Viva Polar Express.....you have to believe!!

John
You can reduce the load a little by considering the fact some European countries celebrate Christmas a bit earlier than the English influenced, in the evening of 24th. So Santa can already start several hours earlier [Linked Image]
Posted By: Bill Addiss Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/23/06 09:03 PM
Here's something you might enjoy. It was from a website called "Allan's Safety Humor Page" which has since moved so I don't know the address or if it still exists.

It's called "Santa's Sleigh (after OSHA)":

[img]https://www.electrical-contractor.net/Fun_Stuff/Santa's%20Sleigh.jpg[/img]

[Linked Image]
Bill
Posted By: georgestolz Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 01:52 AM
Bill, Tom, funny stuff. [Linked Image]
Posted By: mxslick Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 01:59 AM
ROFL!! You guys are too much!!

Merry Christamas, Happy Holidays to all!!

From Tony "I hate shared neutrals" B.

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Tom H Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 12:38 PM
Found this this morning in my inbox from a friend of mine. Seems like the debate ison...


If people are going to attempt to apply science to the question of Santa, the least they can do is to get it right. The so-called "Engineer" that wrote the paper suggesting that Santa Claus is dead had it all wrong.

A) In paragraph 5, the Engineer states that "600,000 tons traveling at 650 miles per second creates enormous air resistance." Assuming that this true, it may well be that the reindeer are protected by some sort of heat shield, which is the basis of the "red nose" legend. More to the point, the "air resistance" theory is a vast oversimplification, and a sloppy one at that. In comparing a parachute to a javelin, one can see that there is no simple, direct, predictable relationship between the weight of an object and its air resistance. The air resistance theory completely ignores many possible configurations of Santa's team that could greatly reduce air resistance.

Paragraph 5 is invalidated all the more when one considers paragraph 1, which states that most of the 300,000 unclassified species on the earth are insects and microorganisms. This suggests that it is overwhelmingly probable that any unknown species (such as flying reindeer) is extremely small (possibly even microscopic), with correspondingly low air resistance.

Also, note that various small species (e.g. bumblebee) have been known to accomplish feats of aviation that have proven quite difficult for science to explain. Furthermore, many small species (e.g. ants) possess strength that is immense proportional to their size. Also note that every known species has a body structure capable of withstanding whatever stresses are created at the top speed at which the creature is capable of traveling.

Therefore, contrary to the Engineer's conclusion, the possible existence of unknown, very small, very strong, flying creatures is indicated, and all of the Engineer's statistics on the mass, speed, capacity, and durability of standard Reindeer are therefore irrelevant.

B) If we accept the notion that Santa moves from East to West (an assumption that the Engineer makes in Paragraph 3) then we must also assume that he is moving in a vaguely North-South traversing path as he works his way West. This implies that, if he chose to, he could make several stops at the Pole to re-load the sleigh, and therefore it is not necessary for him to carry the entire payload all at once as described by the Engineer.

The reader may raise the objection that most depictions of Santa's procedures include a single annual departure from the Pole. However, one must also consider that these same depictions contain many other omissions and simplifications, such as the implication that Santa spends several minutes on each delivery. Even using unrealistically favorable figures, this is mathematically impossible. This and other examples force us to consider these depictions to be strictly allegorical. This makes sense, since a documentary would not be much fun for the target audience.

C) Consider that most chimneys are too small to accommodate an average-sized man, let alone a 250 (plus) pound man. This implies that Santa has a way of entering and exiting dwellings through access paths much smaller than those that would otherwise be required. If the same technique that Santa uses to transport himself and the gifts past locked doors also decreases mass (or makes it irrelevant), then the payload problem is completely solved. (Note that any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.)

D) If we accept the notion that Santa's intelligence gathering is good enough for him to determine who is bad/good, sleeping/awake etc., then it stands to reason that Santa also knows enough about health problems, travel plans, hurricanes, floods, drive-by shootings, fires, volcanoes, earthquakes, bus crashes, burglaries, etc. etc. etc. to be able to defer or advance some of his deliveries for days or even weeks, thus considerably extending the 31 hour time limit (as mentioned by the Engineer in paragraph 3) for perhaps 3 to 5 percent of children.

E) In paragraph 3, the Engineer admits to the assumption that Christian homes are randomly distributed over the entire surface of the planet. In reality, a majority of the earth's surface is covered by the oceans, and a great portion of what is left is covered by mountains, deserts, forests, jungles, glaciers, smaller bodies of water, and other natural and man-made features that render the space uninhabitable by humans -- or at least extremely sparsely populated by Christians, who largely tend to live in communities with homes placed in neat rows on level ground, or in densely populated vertical blocks in urban areas.

Also, many families tend to gather for the Holidays, thus decreasing the number of Christian dwellings that are actually occupied on December 24-25. Therefore, the aforementioned assumption leads to an *staggering* overestimate of the number of times Santa must travel distances exceeding 60 feet. Also note that this more realistic model includes trans-oceanic voyages during which Santa could take a "bathroom break."

F) In paragraph 3, the Engineer says that Santa has a very short time in which to "park, hop out of the sleigh, jump down the chimney, fill the stockings, distribute the remaining presents under the tree, eat whatever snacks have been left, get back up the chimney, get back into the sleigh and move on to the next house. "In the previous paragraph, I dispensed with the notion that Santa must actually park and exit the sleigh, enter and exit the dwelling, and then enter and drive the sleigh for each delivery. As far as the snacks go, it is clear that between the households where the parents eat the snacks prior to Santa's arrival and the households that don't leave snacks at all, Santa has to deal with a snack in only a small proportion of cases. This means that at every stop Santa must, at a minimum, fill stockings and distribute gifts. The other tasks are performed in much smaller proportions.

G) In paragraph 2, the Engineer presents the assumption that roughly 10 children out of 35 are "good." Given my personal observations, I conclude that this would lead us to overestimate of the number of Christian households containing at least one "good" child by an order of magnitude at the absolute minimum. This, more than anything else, decreases the number of stops that Santa must make.

In conclusion - all of the Engineer's calculations are based on figures that are massively skewed, always choosing the worst-case value. The distances to be traveled, the number of stops to be made, the amount of work to be performed, and the amount of cargo to be carried are all FAR smaller than the Engineer estimates.

Santa has NOT been burned to a cinder, he has NOT been squished by the acceleration of his sleigh, and (though I'm quite certain he won't be visiting that Engineer's house,) Santa Claus IS coming to town!
Posted By: georgestolz Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 01:53 PM
This second engineer has one flaw in his reasoning that the first shares:
Quote
In paragraph 2, the Engineer presents the assumption that roughly 10 children out of 35 are "good." Given my personal observations, I conclude that this would lead us to overestimate of the number of Christian households containing at least one "good" child by an order of magnitude at the absolute minimum.
In my personal experience, the antiquated custom of bad children receiving coal in their stockings has been completely overlooked - this function is included in Santa's profile, unless someone else has been subcontracted to complete said task.

In addition, these bad children tend to still wind up with some of the best toys, effectively disproving said custom. [Linked Image]

I was a good kid growing up, and I got apples and oranges in my stockings - what's up with that? [Linked Image]
Posted By: pauluk Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 04:06 PM
Due to the fact that the time spent in each household is so small as to make Santa invisible, perhaps we could also assume that a little cheating is going on?

By employing multiple sleighs & reindeer teams, Santa's workload could be drastically cut by sub-contracting some of the deliveries to his many elves, since no human will be able to tell who actually makes the drop.

Let's not forget that in certain lands Santa's sleigh is supposedly pulled not by flying reindeer but by six white "boomers" (kangaroos). And no, I have no intention of trying to calculate what difference that would make to the timings, speed, and payload figures for the Australian part of the run! [Linked Image]
Posted By: BigJohn Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 04:42 PM
Quote
What kid wants a drawing of a toy with a PE stamp on it and "30% complete" in the lower right corner?
I laughed out loud. "Barring cost-over-runs expected completion is sometime in 2008. Merry Christmas, Timmy."

-John
Posted By: pauluk Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 04:43 PM
And along similar lines: [Linked Image]
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/paulcoxwell/Z_Santa.mp3
Posted By: gfretwell Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 04:47 PM
Santa had gift overload and had to drop one off a day early here.
http://members.aol.com/gfretwell/newcar.jpg

We are already thinking it needs a bigger battery and larger motors, a subwoofer on the radio and xenon HID lights
Posted By: iwire Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 07:28 PM
Quote
From Tony "I hate shared neutrals" B.

Perhaps it would be more accurate like this

From Tony "I never let facts get in the way of anecdotal evidence" B.

[Linked Image]

Merry Christmas, Tony. [Linked Image]

[This message has been edited by iwire (edited 12-24-2006).]
Posted By: mxslick Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 07:31 PM
Methinks Tom H has waaaaaaaayyyyy too much time on his hands!! [Linked Image]

Quote
Merry Christmas, Tony.

Right back at ya, Bob!!! [Linked Image] (I love debating with this guy!!) [Linked Image]

Tony "I knew I'd tweak Bob's tail" B. [Linked Image]
Posted By: iwire Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/24/06 07:53 PM
Quote
Tony "I knew I'd tweak Bob's tail" B.

It's all good, I need that once in while.

Have great and safe year Tony. [Linked Image]
Posted By: mxslick Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/25/06 04:46 AM
Bob, thanks and all the best to you and your family and friends!! [Linked Image]
Posted By: derater Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/26/06 10:01 PM
The engineers perspective;
If an optimist sees the glass as half full, and a pesimist sees it half empty, how does an engineer see it??

Poorly designed !
Posted By: Tom H Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/26/06 10:40 PM
Poorly designed ! not at all.

It just twice as big as it needs to be.
If an optimist sees the glass as half full, and a pesimist sees it half empty, how does an engineer see it??

He doesn't see it. His eyes crapped out years ago from doing CADD on a 15 inch monitor.
Joe
Posted By: rws Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/28/06 07:26 PM
Many theoretical physicists believe the theories of Einstein, which are "thought models." Their descriptive math, the Lorentzian Transforms, were based on the equally mystical "aether".

It is incongruous to say that Santa could not exist in a world where people believe the universe follows the ideas dreamed up by a guy who failed algebra, twice, and consistently skipped physics classes at university.

Santa lives!
Posted By: Alan Belson Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/28/06 09:49 PM
No one will ever know how fast Santa travels, because if he looks at his speedometer, he gets lost, [ cf. Werner Heisenberg, viz- you can see a high speed object or you can measure it's speed- but you can't do both ]. This is why engineers don't buy Santa Clause. They're too busy measuring his velocity......

Albert E. Neumann, Mad scientist.
Of whom Marylyn Monroe once said; "Who's that obnoxious little @~%$*<*!"
Posted By: electure Re: Santa Claus:An Engineers Perspective - 12/29/06 12:23 AM
Alan, your MAD scientist may be behind all these crazy figures and calculations.

You see, Santa Claus is really............

[Linked Image]

Alfred E. Neuman!!
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