Hello Everyone,
This is my first post, thanks for taking the time to check it out.

I'm an "Underground Tech" in San Diego, and have been trying very hard to get into the Apprenticeship program. I started working for a Union company as an Underground Tech a couple of months ago, I've passed the Apprenticeship test, and I have the Interview in two weeks. I am very a mechanically inclined person, a very hard worker, and really fit in at the job-site. Being an Electrician is REALLY what I want to do for the rest of my life and I have been EXTREMELY enthusiastic about it.

The problem is, I have a weak knee. The work has been harder on my knee than I expected. I'd guess, if I take very good care of my knee, and maybe have surgury, the knee will hold up OK for the 20-25 years till retirement.

I haven't, and won't tell anyone at work, except for one JW that I really trust. He told me first that this isn't the job for me. He then said if I still chose to be an Electrician, that I would have to hide the problem, hide my knee-brace and hide a limp, otherwise I would be viewed as a liability by the company and possibly laid-off, or be given a tough time.

I guess what my question is:
Is it really true that I will have to hide EVERYTHING, including a limp, or risk being blackballed or something to that effect?

Has anyone else made it in this trade having some type of physical difficulty? Or does everyone hide their achs and pains, or is everyone in perfect health...

Being an Electrician means EVERYTHING to me. But I am having to decide if I can pull this off with a less-than perfect body.

Please give me your input. I have a VERY big decision to make.

Thanks in advance.
Sincerely,
Brian.

Brian,Welcome to ECN, its the mind that needs to be in the best shape, and yours sounds as if its OK. As you get older you get wiser and just because your not as fit as you used to be it does not prevent you from doing the job, you learn to think the job through more and cope that way. Good luck to you.
Alan

Welcome...
Interseting and odd first post!

Unless you're a cash in hand "under the table" guy, I wouldn't consider you "Underground". I'll limit my comments to that.

As for the knee, if it be a legitimate job related injury, or a week-end football thing. (two different stories...no need to hide either)It is all up to you on how comfortable you are with the work, as far as if you'd like to continue in the trade or not. If you are able to work... Being "Blackballed" or discriminated against for any reason is against the law! So is trying to call a football injury a 'Comp case as well, so if not trying to do that, I see no problem.

Personally, I have trick knee, and back that wakes me up a 3AM. Both could be a combination of snowboarding, all the crazy stuff I did in the Marines, or that time I got knocked off a ladder and bounced out a window. Who knows! I don't know where they came from, I can still work and do, and I'm not putting a claim in for them, so it's not an issue. If I did have a serious legitimate workplace injury I might file a claim, but I wouldn't call that an abuse of the system either. Nor could I legally be discriminated against if I did!

A good sorce of information on workplace rights....
http://www.dir.ca.gov/

Some information on workplace ergonomics for the Electrical Trade too:

https://www.dir.ca.gov/dosh/dosh_publications/ElectriciansErgo.pdf

And all Electricians in California check out this too: Certification REQUIRED in 4 months!
http://www.dir.ca.gov/DAS/ElectricalTrade.htm



[This message has been edited by e57 (edited 08-29-2004).]

Brian,
All of us have our physical and mental limitations. Most supervisors know everybody's limitations and schedule the work accordingly. You can and will find the right niche for yourself in this trade.

As Alan basically said, your mind is the most important asset. Heavy industrial/commercial work might not be the best place for you, but there will always be work for an educated and enthusiastic electrician. I know guys that have been in the trade for 25+ years and really aren't much more than a (barely) warm body and a pair of hands. Just show up every day and you will always have a job.

Much as I'd like to chime in and agree with the preceeding encouraging words, I can't. Unless you can spend a whole day climbing up and down a step ladder without your knee bothering you, then the electrical trade is out. If your knee pain is due to insufficient muscle tone, then that is easily fixed..no problem.

Thank you all for the replies,
I really appreciated it.

Just to clear up a couple of points...
My knee problem is the result some sports injuries, starting with High School, not something happened on the job.

and in San Diego, they call the ditch-digger and material handler type laborers "underground tech." I'm doing that to get experience before I apply for the apprenticship.

Thanks for the welcome Alan, and the ecouraging words.

Thanks for the links e57.
I knew there are laws protecting disabled workers, but I didn't know if they held up at all for those of us with sore knees, or backs, or whatever else.

Pat,
That is what I figured from the beginning. That if I worked hard and smart, and was the best electrican at the site, they'd overlook the limp and be glad to have me there. Thanks for the words.

Elzappr,
Thanks for your honesty. I agree, it would be like torture to go up and down a ladder, in pain, all day. I plan on having the best knee brace available made for me. I'm hoping that the brace, along with strength training, will allow me to avoid any more damage.


It was when my co-worker told me I'd have to hide everything of get possibly laid-off, that I got very concerned, and started having second thoughts. But, there are laws against that, and I plan on using my brain to help avoid any physical problems.

Thanks again for the input everyone. Hopefully you'll see me back here after I've learned some stuff and am actually be able to contribute to this site.

Take care everyone.
Sincerely,
Brian.




[This message has been edited by BrianSD (edited 08-29-2004).]

Brian,
You shouldn't leave and come back later. Stay and learn. I just joined and these guys are a goldmine of knowledge.

Hello Everyone.

I posted this question a few months ago, and just wanted to say thanks again, and give an update.

I have since been promoted to "intermediate wireman." I'm no longer in the ditches but transfered to a big highrise project and have traded in the shovel for wire-strippers. My knee is no longer bothering me *at all*, due to working on a solid surface, strengthening, and better working technique. The career is moving along very well and I'm very happy with my choice. I learn something every day and my managers say I do a very good job :-)

I just wanted to give you guys an update after you took the time to answer the first time.

Thanks, Brian.

Brian,
Glad to hear you are doing well, check in the chat site Mon, Wed or Fri with questions or just to chat.

Les

Everyone I work with has a limp!
I wear carhartt carpenter bibs with kneepads stuffed in the double knee part. They work great, and my knees thank me every time kneel down. -Ben

You sound like you've got your most important assets covered...Your attitude and your willingness.
Who knows, The knee may hurt less as time goes on. There's no sense in trying to deceive anybody with hiding a limp. You won't ever feel good about lying, and of course someone will notice anyway.

Nearly 20 yrs ago, I broke my ankle into 6 pieces & imped for years (It still takes a dump on me once in a while.)
If I had let it stop me, and not continued with the trade, I would have gotten much more pain out of missing what I love to do than I've ever gotten from the injury.

Take every precaution you can to work safely, and use all the proper safety gear.
It's not "cool" or "manly" to beat the heck out of yourself like some of us dummies thought in the old days.
Now you've got Repetetive Stress Syndrome We used to have My &*%#* Wrist Hurts Again
Good Luck

Thanks a lot guys for the tips and encouragement. Like I said, work is going very well and I feel like I've finally found my niche. I'm still waiting to get into the apprenticeship, but I've established a good reputation with my current company, so maybe I'll end up staying with them and taking the Journeyman test in a few years. Either way, I'll achieve my goal of becoming a Journeyman. ...and I feel like my body will hold up fine. I'm keeping up with the kids on the crew, and then some, so its looking good for me. Glad you guys talked me through my doubts a few months ago!
Brian.

Brian,
You will find out that the electrical trade is one of the broadest fields out there. Do not let anyone tell you that just because you have an injury or a limp that the electrical trade is not a good choice.

I have been in the trade over 27 years and I know a lot of one arm electricians and I know a lot of electricians who have been able to hold down a job with some pretty severe injuries and that can work circles around some healthy guys. They may get assigned a different task but it all needs to be done..I even know a few split tails that can make you think twice about this being a mans job!

It would be very scary to think that I was not able to do all the things I want to do and worry that I may not be able to tow the line like I used to in the good ol days, but everybody faces that at one time or another.

You are only limited by what you are willing to do and all you need is an opportunity.

I know electricians who are terrified of heights, clostophobic, afraid of working underground or afraid of flying. As an electrician you may be subjected to a lot of abuse..maybe even hit the road someday and be willing to get on that silver bird and risk your life to make a buck or two. I used to fly to work in a float plane in Alaska to a remote fish hatchery for $20 an hour and two weeks on and one week off! I thought it was fun, somedays I wasnt sure if i was coming back or not...but i made it and i am glad i did it..

There are electricians heading over to Iraq and Afghanistan who may be afraid to die but they go anyway.

Some days you may be pulling wire down in a manhole and have a couple hundred gallons of puke gush out in your face or you may have to work 60 feet in the air ty-wrapping cable in a cable tray when it is 45 below, or running pipe off some I-beam glazed over with ice..then again you could be terminating a control panel inside the building or you may be an electrical designer drawing everything on AutoCad or doing a hundred other different jobs all of which none require you to ever come near a ladder.

Yes it is good to have the ability to do it all but in reality nobody does it all all the time..just find what your good at and what you LIKE to do..that is the key..have fun and be happy..life is too short to hate what you do...you have to love electrical work or you will not do good work..

You sound like a good candidate for the trade. I say bow up get in there and become a sponge for information, get a code book and a handbook everytime it comes out and read every page..you will eventually find your spot..

dont let anyone tell you you cant be an electrician..or an engineer or whatever you want to be...just remember there are not many trades out there that come close to the electrical trade..it is a profession you can be proud of and the best part is once you learn it nobody can take that away from you..even if your writing with a pencil hanging out of your mouth with one eye you can still be a valuable asset..

the electrical trade gets the most respect out in the field..

just remember...electricity has no respect for ignorance..that means any kind of ignorance..

hang in there and let us know how things are a year from now..

-regards

Mustang

[This message has been edited by mustangelectric (edited 11-05-2004).]

Thanks Mustang. I'll be around... There really is a wealth of information here, and plenty of people happy to help.
Brian.

"hang in there and let us know how things are a year from now..

-regards
Mustang"


Heya' Mustang!
Well, its been a year and want to check back and let you all know how its going.

I've gotten into the apprenticeship and started classes. For the interview I brought "letters of reccomendation" from my Journeyman, Forman and Company President!
I think that was pretty helpfull getting in ;-)

I've been busting my azz and learning a LOT! Haven't missed a day in over a year. I've worked with a half-dozen Formen and they are glad to have me there and thank me for a good job when I leave.

About my knee, I've learned what types of motions irritate it, and avoid those like the plague. It gets a little sore occasionally but it is mostly fine.

Also, now I know guys with bum knees, backs and whatever else. I also see the Co Pres scheduling them extra help, because they are appreciated, and he wants to help keep them healthy.

So guys, a sincere thanks, for taking the time to offer encouragement when I had my doubts. I love this trade and am proud to be an electrician.

Brian.

Good to hear you are doing well, stop in to chat.

Mon 9:00 EST till ?
Wed 9:00 EST till ?
Fri 9:00 EST till ?

LK

Brian,
Welcome back, mate!.
Can I ask what caused the injury in the first place?.
I have to agree with Electure though, your attitude is in the right place.
From a guy that had to learn to walk again after serious burns a few years back, I know what you are up against.
Don't hide it mate, it's like being too fat around pretty women, you can suck in your chest all you like, sooner or later you'll let go.
At the end of the day, who really cares, as long as you can do the work.
Work on that mate.

Brian,
REAL glad to hear everything is going OK, sounds like you got the world by the tail, bud.

Knees happen, backs happen, you TRY to look out for the guys on injured reserve. I've got both and take a bit of teasing from the gang on occasion.

Example: A few days ago, my boss (who's known me a long time) yelled out the door, "Hey George, I need you to run over to look at X" One of the 'pups' we've got around here, stuck his head in the office and said, "Hey Al, George has 2 gears, amble and stroll and when he REALLY gets excited, he'll break into a mosey, but RUN ain't in the cards"

Hee hee, funny kid.... they AIN'T finding the corpse.

Sometimes the folks who have to work a "tad" slower have more value than a fireball. Enjoy

If you really like electrical work and you have health problems that knock you out of doing the heavy work there are alternatives.

I know several guys that ended up with bad backs, knees, and shoulders who went into drafting, engineering, and PLC programming. As you have read in previous posts an Electicians mind is his greatest assett.

Keep your mind sharp and you can be doing electrical related work until well after the legal retirement age. That is if you can keep up with the N.E.C. changes and technology.

Thanks again for the welcome fellas'.

Hey Trumpy,
Sorry to hear about your burns. I sincerely hope you have made a good recovery. I know burns are a horrible experience to have to endure. I wrote a college paper once on burn treatment, and just reading about the ordeal made me queezy. I can't imagine having to go through that...

You ask what I originally did to my knee... When I was 16, 22 years ago, I crashed my bicycle and popped my ACL (anterior cruciate ligament). Back then reconstructive surgery was a huge ordeal, and pretty much reserved for professional athletes. Ofcourse I have kept skiing, surfing and whatever else, and reinjuring it, due to it's no-ACL-having, less-than-normal-stability. So now its a little banged up and loose because I still have no ACL. ACL reconstruction is now out, because its too loose, causing a new ligament to just stretch or snap. Basically, I need to be very careful how I move so I don't let it wiggle too much and cause an injury. Like I said though, on the job I've learned exactly what not to do, so I can avoid those actions. Hope this isn't TMI, but you ask ;-)

rad74ss, thats a great suggestion, moving on to a less physical specialty. I was stoked to find out that all my apprenticeship classes will count as college credit. I already have all my lower division work done, so I'll be a lot of the way towards an EE degree at the end of my apprenticeship. Thats something I'd really like to get in the future. Maybe my knee will help nudge me in that direction. pun...

Anyway, thanks again guys. Will be talking to ya'
Brian.

You have the right train of thought. I have 2 weak ankles, and 1 semi bad knee. You will learn what effects them and how to avoid it. Just remember speed is not always the best thing. Your mind is. The more you know and can do makes you more a valuable employee. Hang in there and never stop learning !!!