My fee to upgrade a residental service to 200 amps is $900-1200 depending on whats required this includes all materials.Is this about the average fee for you guys ? I work alone, no helpers or other overhead.this is a 4-6 hour job if i have all the materials on the truck

Hey mj..ive never had to due a panel upgrade yet..but how do you go about it with the inspection. Due you call edison in first, have your meter spot then hang your panel. My buddies usually hang the panel then call edison ?

drgnz, the permit fee is about $25.once I get the pemit from the city,I just do the work according the the 2002 nec. I have no problems passing the inspection.I just use the correct conductor size/type,proper disconnects, proper grounding and bonding, and do the work and a neat/workmanship manner, and it will pass inspection every time.

That's about what I try to get to change out the panel, new rigid pipe and wire to meter, update the ground system, and fix all the violations with in reach.

Too many times someone elce under cuts my price a few hundered and they give the customer much less like a bigger 100 amp panel or a sub panel.

The materials add up with a 40 space panel, new breakers, 3ott, 2", ground rod, # 4, plus all the little things.

4 hours for 1 person seems fast but I don't know if you have EMT much in your area.

If we are talking about redoing the outside meter and overhead then I try to get $1400-1800. Try is the key word.

Tom

..I usually will not touch an upgrade for less than $1500.00, and that is for using SEU cable from the P.O.A. to the meter,and then to the panel...If I MUST use pipe,ie;on the driveway side,or customer preference,it's around $1800.00-$1900.00 and that is for 2"- schedule 80 pvc..
..I run 2 ground rods,..and spend time IDing the panel,as well as bonding the water meter,and hot water heater..
AR

Around $1500 or so.
Attic rat, how is pipe worth an addtional $300-$400?

In my area to upgrade to 200 amp we have to use new SER to the panel from a new outside disco and meter base. The absolute minimum we charge is $2000. Depending on what we have to do to get the SER to the panel, it can go up to $3000. In my area it is usually a 2 day process to complete with inspection and the poco.

We do a simple 150 amp panel change for $750.

I won't touch one for less than $1,100.00.
Excluding permits and inspections.


New mounting board if in basement
New MB panel
All new breakers
New meter socket
New SEU cable
Update GE system

About 400.00 materials
Average 10-12 man-hours labor.

[This message has been edited by Redsy (edited 01-20-2004).]

..Its called my time and aggravation factor,...
..it is also negotiable,depending on the job,customer,and my mood for the day!!

Costs are all over for this I guess.
I charge 1800 for a new 200 in PVC including permit. I always install a 4X4 section of 3/4 one side finish plywood and make it look very nice. PVC all the way up and in unless I can come out the back of the meter which makes the job look great.

I try to make the service look good. It's one time where our work gets a chance to show its self off. With service upgrades, I allways paint the 3/4" 2x4 plywood with 1 coat of weatherproof primer and 2 coats of weatherproof battleship gray paint. It looks good with the panel on it, and the wires neatly put into the panel. With the water main clamps, I use the scotchkote 3M coating over the clamp. The clamp does not rust or corrode with that stuff on it.
Those pipes build a lot of moisture on them in the summer time. Price range from 1,200.00 and up, for 100 amp. 200 amp in the area of 1,800.00 and up. All are with PVC conduit.

the state of Vermont had upgraded 210.12 to encompass all living area''s.

this meant new breakers, material wise, outcost all else.(anyone else ever try and stuff 30 AFCI's in a panel here?)

Jeff Sargent, on behalf of somebody who inquired (no, i'm not sure who) 'interpeted' 210.12 as not being meant for upgrades.

you won't find this in our state addendums, but as i was told this point blank from a state inspector i trust , i consider it solid.

as such, estimates are now back down to what the rest of the world is doing...

~S~

In this area 200A Copper bus panel with 20 breakers installed, lateral in PVC with copper conductors. 2 ground rods as required, re-run the undersized grounding elect, with #4. To cover overhead and make 8% profit. $1,870 plus permit fee. They could be done for less if I drop my E&O insurance and get an $800.00 a year policy,
instead of $3,500 a year policy. Pick up a junker truck and run it to the ground, stop medical payments of $2,490 per mo., stop paying company share of income tax, stop paying $1,200 a month advertising, stop paying for accounting services, and all other insurances, stop paying fo truck maint. and repair. Well then about $1,100 for a 200A service.

LK, you bring up a good point about the difference in overhead. For me, I have office rent, a full time inventory manager/phone answerer/controller, office utilities, vehicle payments, vehicle insurance, workmans comp, liability ins, CPA, etc. If a guy's working out of his house with an old truck an no workman's comp, he can do the job much cheaper. I notice you said a 200 amp panel with 20 breakers, in our area the houses must be larger because we usually come close to filling up a 40 circuit panel.

[This message has been edited by Electric Eagle (edited 01-20-2004).]

Eagle,
If you fill them up, you have to charge more. Yes, the guys working from home, not realizing their real overhead, until it's too late, usually end up going back to work at the local Salt Mine. It's just that while they are out there losing money, It costs the rest of us, that are trying to pay our bills.

Just because a one man shop does a job cheaper does not mean he is unaware of business costs. I am a 1 man show and don't have nearly the monthly expense you do, should I be charging the same price as a 10-20 man shop for work?

A one man show competes by trading volume (in which we are not competitive) for cost efficy, so it evens out imho...

One also gets the master, and not the apprentice , or any half hearted 'ratio' that most bigger outfits tend to fudge on.

a local plumbing shop serves as good example here, having approx 75 employees, and a 1/2 dz masters

of course, my state has only one plumbing inspector, he's new btw...(the last one rumored to have succumbed to alchol dependency)

(see....someone always has it worse!)

~S~



[This message has been edited by sparky (edited 01-21-2004).]

So on average, everyone is charging on the average of $8.00 per amp on a service upgrade. Wow, in my area the contractors would be sitting around more than working. The most in my area is between $6.00 to $7.00 per amp.
Doug

Other than inheriting a business, doesn't mostly everybody begin by "working from home" and also "doing side work".
As long as you are properly licensed and carry liability insurance, what's the issue?


[This message has been edited by Redsy (edited 01-21-2004).]

Redsy,
We are a small shop 3 men, There is no issue,
I was ref. to the area we work in, where costs of being in business are very high along with labor costs. Not all areas of the country are the same. The shops that have the same overhead and are not aware of it, not the one man operation, which is fine as you said most small business start this way and grow. It is best to track your real expenses from day one, and this will help your business grow.

[This message has been edited by LK (edited 01-21-2004).]

LK,

LK,
I know what you mean. Here in PA, there is no state licensing requirement. They leave it up to the local municipalities.
Most have no exam requirement. Just pay a fee, show proof of liability, and you're in business. Some, including mine, where most new houses cost more than $700,000., have no licensing requirement at all.
It is tough to compete, pricewise, with "GCs" who do their own wiring.

Redsy,
I know what PA is like, I have a home in Sterling, and my daughter lives near Scranton. Yes, it is wild west up there for any type of work.