I ran a total of 28 lins of CAT5+ cable to 13 different locations.
1 phone line to each
1 network line to each
1 printer line to 2 locations
Now the customer wants me 2 install all the jacks. This was not in the original plan. I can to the individual locations but what do I do on the other end? Where they all come together. Anyone know of a website describing the equioment I need?
Thanks
Bob

You need to ask the customer what he really wants. There are punchdown patch panels that are usually rackmount - read pricey. I have seen surface mount plastic blocks that will hold 4 jacks. In my house, I just put a couple of 2x4 boxes on a backing board and used faceplates with 4 jacks each. For the phone side, I used a "66" block and punched down all 4 pairs of each cat5. That allows up to 4 idependant phone lines. If you keep it simple, you can find all the parts you need at the local Big Orange Box. If it gets complicated, Graybar handles a lot of networking hardware.

elecbob,- I am sure you know some tele-data installers. Get a quote from them to install the ends and punch downs. Then you tack on your mark-up and give your quote to the owner as a extra, since it was not in your bid. I do this all the time and it seems to work.

the '66' blocks , per Big Jim are easiest..

the ones i use come in 3 sizes, DD1,DD2,DD3 which are just a JB, the options from there are quite intricate, Leviton makes varied models of structured media...
a base model (also just a JB)

ana advanced...

one can even incluse a DSL or router...




you'll need to get a punchdown tool for this...

networking is big, there are also many forums addressing the particulars...

i thought cat 5 cable needed a cat 5 connector matching the number of pairs and a crimp tool?

that's the user end rizer...


or one use plates w/ screw down terminals...

Electbob;

Go for it!
If you have the time (and can make a profit too!), I would suggest you do the punchdowns on all ends.
If you need additional help in these areas, feel free to ask us, or contact directly via E-mail (contact me
if needed).

As suggested, get some 66 blocks for the voice terminations at the TBB, and a nice CAT-5 rated
patch bay (patch panel) for the Data terminations.
We set up an "MDF" (Main Distribution Frame) which contains patch panels for both voice and data, then
the LAN equipment gets set on the MDF. Voice / Analog phone stuff is connected to the peripheral
telephone equipment via 25 pair runs to whatever is needed (or directly to the PET - Protected
Entrance Terminal at the MPOE - Minimum Point Of Entrance).

At first, the work may be confusing, and a bit overbearing - but after time it will become second nature!

Being able to do these installs may allow your company to take on more work.

There's one aspect of this stuff not yet addressed as I can see - Certification of Installations. This
requires a pricey $$$ tester. Basically what this means is (if required by the client), after the LAN
cabling is installed + identified (outlets / ports ID), testing is done for CAT-"X" compliance.
Not difficult to do, just keep things "right" and you should pass tests!

That brings up another thing - colors for cable jackets!
Do yourself a big favor and use two different colors for your system types! Common ones are Yellow for
Data and Blue for Voice (Analog/Telephone).
When installing colored cables, be sure the pulling force does not result in "Sections Of White Jacket"
on colored cables! This happens when cables get strrrreeeeettttcccchhhheeedddddd!
Stretched cables usually result in a CAT-5 cable not being Certifiable for CAT-5 (100 MBPS).
Known as "Dog-5", this can really suck!

Good luck!

Scott35

"DOG 5"... That's hits the nail on the head.

All we do is telecom and data. Here is what you need to do:

1) Data jacks are orange, CAT5 or better. ALWAYS USE THE 568B WIRING SCHEME. I recommend Leviton #41108-RO5. These are "keystone" jacks that snap into a plate. Single gang plates are available with up to six ports.(Six jacks). We usually use the 3 port, #41080-3*P. (replace * with W for white, I for ivory). Use #41084-B*B to blank up any unused ports.

2) The voice jacks are CAT3. These are 6 pin jacks #41106-R*6. Only punch down the wh/bl and the wh/or pairs. The other two pairs are spares. We always make the voice jacks the same color as the plate.

3) At the other end, terminate the voice runs on a 66 block. (Leviton #40066-M25)(Sorry Sparky, I've never seen that junk you are using.) This is a split 50 pair block which means that you can put 6 four pair cables on each side. Always install a 66 block on a 89D standoff bracket. (Leviton # 40089-D) YOU WILL HAVE TO KNOW THE COLOR CODE!! If a telcom vendor is going to install a system DO NOT DO ANYTHING WITH THE VOICE CABLES. Don't punch them down, leave them long enough at least to reach the floor. Cut them all to the same length and coil them up together into one neat coil. Don't waste your time marking or tagging the runs. We will tone them out as we terminate them.

4) The data runs get terminated on a patch panel. For 13 runs you will need a 16 port #59484-U16. This is a 1 space by 19" rack panel. Use a hinged wall bracket to mount it to the wall. REMEMBER TO USE THE 568B SCHEME when you punch your cables down.

5) You will need a punch down tool with a 66 blade for the 66 blocks and a 110 blade for the jacks and patch panel.

6) NEVER, repeat NEVER even think about certifying the data runs (voice runs don't get certified) unless you absolutely have to. CAT5 cable must be run absolutely without kinks, tight bends or crushes and must be terminated flawlessly. If any of this is not met it will not certify. This doesn't mean it won't work or anyone will notice a problem (unless you really butchered it), it just won't certify and you will have to replace the run. No matter how much experience you have, or how many helpers, you always will have kinks in this stuff. Hopefully you straighten them out but the run can still can fail certification.

7) If you are using plenum rated cable, consider using CAT3 for voice. This is less than half the price of CAT5.

Just want to ask why? I too use the 568B wiring, but is there any problem as long as everything in the building is done the same way? I have seen 568A called out in specs.
Don

WOW! What a wealth of information. Thank you very much. I've spent a few days doing punchdowns. Not my favorite thing but it beats working in an attic or crawlspace.
I bought a 12 position wall mount patch panel for the data cables. I will terminate 3 cables in a standard 3 position faceplate mounted in the wall next to the patch panel. The phone lines will be terminated 2-6 position face plates. The customer is installing a hub with CAT3 jacks so he can patchcord to that. The phone people do the rest.
Once again, thanks you all for your help.
bob
I pulled in CAT5E and I was gentle doing it.

Don, the only difference between 568A and 568B is that the wh/orange pair and wh/green pairs are swapped. The 568B standard is the old Western Electric standard used by the voice terminals that utilized 8 pin plugs (Merlin). Many older or even new unmarked jacks will be 568B if you follow the color coding on the jack. I would say that most systems are wired this way. Our standard is 568B just to avoid problems and confusion.

I don't remember why 568A was implemented or why someone would prefer it over 568B since its only a color coding issue. If that's what the customer wants it's probably because some "computer head" wanted it.

Yes, as long as you do on one end what you do on the other you will be OK but you have to decide what you are going to do and stick to it for all of your jobs.

Amen to the sticking to the scheme! I was trimming a job a couple of months ago. I was at the panel punching down while my helper was punching jacks. He told me he was done so I told him to get my LAN tester while i was finishing the video cables. I plugged in 8 remotes and they were all swapped. As soon as i said "did you use 568B or A" he got one of those funny looks on his face.

I've worked on a few existing LANs which used 568A assignment. >90% I deal / dealt with are 568B, and is the norm assignment I use (unless the equipment used requires 568A methodology).

Electbob:

How did everything turn out at the project in question?

Scott35

HBISS..... I odd time I dabble in networking when my customers request it. Its a lot of fun and very interesting to do. I too was taught to use the "B" colour scheme and is what I use 100% of the time.

Anyways, I notice you favour Leviton products. Up to now, I've only used P&S and just started using Panduit. Do you have any experiences with these other names, or is the Leviton superior?

I've used the Leviton stuff mostly because it's easier for me to get, and get what I want.
The 568B is what I use, unless directed differently.

We use the Hubbell jacks.
Don

Speaking as a junior-assistant-to-the-chief-helper datacomm trainee, 568B corresponds to the classical Bell 258A standard, which, among other things is standard in ISDN equipment. All of the ‘noninterchangeable’ fixed/surface-mount “8-postion/4-pair” blocks seem to be TIA568B.

I thoroughly detest any sort of the so-called “universal” A/B dual-coded connectors. Remember that 10baseT and 100baseT network uses two (of four) pairs.

Just if anyone is wondering / needs to know / is bored / (fill-in your own term);

Here's some info per Application-Specific Pair Assignments, as would be found on 4 Pair Cables, along with Mod. Jacks + Plugs (8-Pin / Position):

<OL TYPE=A>


[*] Analog Voice: Pins 4-5 = TX / RX, 1-2. 3-6 & 7-8 not used;


[*] ISDN: Pins 1-2 & 7-8 = Power, 3-6 = TX, 4-5 = RX;


[*] 10 BASE-T: Pins 1-2 = TX, 3-6 = RX. 4-5 & 7-8 not used;


[*] Token Ring: Pins 3-6 = TX, 4-5 = RX. 1-2 & 7-8 not used;


[*] ATM User Device: Pins 1-2 = TX, 7-8 = RX. 3-6 & 4-5 = Opt.¹;


[*] ATM Network Eq.: Pins 1-2 = RX, 7-8 = TX. 3-6 & 4-5 = Opt.¹;


[*] 100 BASE-VG: Pins 1-2, 3-6, 4-5 & 7-8 = Bi.²;


[*] 100 BASE-T4: Pins 1-2 = TX, 3-6 = RX. 4-5 & 7-8 = Bi.²;


[*] 100 BASE-TX: Pins 1-2 = TX, 3-6 = RX. 4-5 & 7-8 not used;


[*] 1000 BASE-T: Pins 1-2, 3-6, 4-5 & 7-8 = Bi.².
</OL>

Key:
"TX" = Transmit, "RX" = Receive.
"Opt.¹" = Optional Terminations on some equipment, "Bi.²" = Bidirectional.

Scott35

Sandro, I never knew that P&S made this stuff. Looks like everybody is getting into the act. We standardized on Leviton since it is quality and available. Panduit is OK and I belive it will fit a Leviton plate and vice versa. I had Hubbell jacks fall apart while punching them down and they won't fit a Leviton or Panduit plate. Enough said about Hubbell.

The job went great! I used all Leviton push-in jacks on the load end of the network and a 12 bay patch panel on the line end. For the phones I used the Leviton jacks on both ends. Everything rang out correctly with no cross connections.My supply house didn't have the Leviton parts in house so I went to the orange palace. I ordered a 3COM 3C16702A hub for the phones. I will install it and use patch cords to connect it to the jacks. The phone vender is installing a 66 patch panel and connecting it to the lines from the utility. The whole job equired 15 labor hours. Would I do it again? You betcha!
Thanks again for all your help.
Bob

hbiss,

What would happen if you were to use a 8 pin jack for voice?

If you only terminate the wh/bl or wh/or pairs doesn't that limit the ability to change the function of that jack at a patch panel for structured wiring?

I' m in the middle of my first structured wiring job and know I still have a lot to learn.

Elecbob, you're not in Kansas any more!

Push-in jacks= keystone jacks
Load end= work stations or extension jacks
Line end= telephone or server closet/room

You have to learn to talk the talk and walk the walk! This isn't electrical work.

For the phones I ordered a 3COM 3C16702A hub.
Huh? That's an ethernet hub for the network. Why are you supplying that anyway. That's up to the computer guy to provide.

Jim:
Though it's probably done frequently, I never recommend that one wiring system be installed that can alternate between voice and data. We always provide CAT 5e (currently) for the network and CAT 3 for voice. The CAT 5 is terminated on 8 pin 568B jacks while the CAT 3 is terminated on 6 position 4 pin USOC jacks. The first two pairs are normally punched down, the other two are spares. The spares can be used for faxes, modems or even another phone. The additional jacks are added to the plate as necessary. The reasons for all of this are:

1) CAT 3 plenum is much cheaper than CAT 5e plenum.
2) CAT 3 is easier to terminate because you don't have to untwist tightly twisted pairs.
3) CAT 3 is easier to "tone out".
4) The network and telephone system are two completely different animals most often maintained and administered by different people.
5) The network wiring gets terminated on a patch panel which in turn is connected to a hub or router with patch cords.
6) The voice wiring gets terminated on a 66 or 110 block. From there the first two pairs are cross connected to a similar block from the key system or PBX. The spare pairs, where used, are cross connected to whatever they need to be connected to. You can't do this with a patch panel.
7) Most voice terminals (telephones) use the familiar 4 pin 6 position plug. While they will fit into an 8 position jack, the sides of the smaller plug can damage the two outside contacts on the jack.
8) Voice terminals use USOC jacks. The two pairs are the normal w/bl and w/or which are pairs 1 and 2. 568B data jacks use w/bl and w/gn as the corresponding pairs if you were to use it for voice. Very confusing especially since they are punched down in order of 1, 2, 3, 4 at the block.

Sorry hbiss. I've been really busy with work and I composed the reply rather hastily. Next time I will wait till things slow down and I can take the time to write coherantly.
bob