It's been nearly a year since CA started taking applications for Electrician Certification Exams, which cover employees of Electrical Contractors.
As of Nov 7, the entire state had only 1533 electricians certified.
If you don't pass this exam by 1-1-05, you might as well learn how to hang drywall because you'll no longer be working as an electrician.
What's everybody waiting for??

electure,

Is there a "Grandfather" clause?
I know PA has voted down legislation for state licensing several times, but I read the bill.
It has a fairly liberal grandfather clause which exempts contractors with 6 years in the business from having to test.

Redsy

There is not grandfather clause but the certification only applies to employees of electrical contractors. A single person shop is not required to get certified.

One of the big problems I have with this certification program is that it doesn’t apply to all electricians only those employed by electrical contractors. While most commercial projects are done by electrical contractors many general contractors do their own residential work. I wouldn’t be surprised if some of the small residential shops drop their electrical contractors license and get a general contractors license. They would then be required to do more that one trade on the job but they could work this out easy enough. The primary general contractor on the project could simply have the electrical contractor, now a general contractor bill them for electrical wiring plus some framing or other work even if they didn’t do the other work. The reason that the primary general contractor might be willing to do this is to save money. I know that many of the supposed residential journeymen will not be able to pass this test so the electrical contractor will not have to hire real journeymen which will mean big rate increases. I feel this certification should apply to all electricians. Most of the really bad electrical work I see is not done by electrician but by carpenters or other tradesmen trying to be electricians.

Curt

I am with you Curt.
I know a contractor with a (B) license that does electrical work only and some how he has not been caught yet.He has his ways around the rules and regulations but it is not fair to electricians.

I think the state should have much stricter lures and regulations and have people follow up on contractors.

Not sure I understand why they are doing this, do you have to be licensed to do electrical work in California?? besides a contractors license?? Just curious

I share Curt's concerns about the ways around the certifications, and I agree that it should apply to all people doing electrical work.
A C-10 (electrical) license holder will only be able to work on his/her own job without being certified, not work for somebody else.
In this area, a GC has to be doing 3 or more trade's jobs in order to pull an electrical permit.
Small TI jobs or residential, maybe they'll get away with it. A one man shop will not be able to tackle anything bigger without raising suspicion.

The simple fact is though, that agree or disagree, this is not simply going to "go away".

Is it just the nature of people to wait until the last second...like Christmas shopping? If people would just go take the silly 4 hour exam instead of spending countless hours trying to figure out how to circumvent the system....(Ahh, I should know better than that)...S


[This message has been edited by electure (edited 12-02-2003).]

Yeah, me again, the original intent was:
Guys and Gals, you need to apply and take the test. The sooner the better. If you're not certain you'll pass, that's all the more reason...so you can find out what you need to study to pass it. A Retest is available, but costs more $. Bid Deal, huh?. It's going to be a clustersmash when it get's to the end of the year.
There's no way out of this

Put yourself ahead. Get with it.
If you haven't studied, get off your butt and do what you should have done all along...S



[This message has been edited by electure (edited 12-02-2003).]

Took the test early, got paid all day the day I took it, Union reimbursed me for the cost of the test and license, didn't have to pay for any study courses thanks to ECN! Thanks for the site Bill.

At the "Circus" (former EC firm) I had been involved with recently, the "Lead Clown" (my former boss) wanted me to get all field workers in the Company ready for this exam.

Sounded like a challenge I could do, so agreed to perform this education task (when it comes to teaching, there's no question about it - I'll do it!!!).

Lead Clown agreed to pay for me to take one of the Refresher Courses, given by "ABC", and to pay for the certification + examination fees (no mention to travel or other non productive items, but just having someone agree to pay the exam + refresher items was more than enough to me!).

I took said refresher course. Passed it, and even received a certificate of passing from ABC.

Went to Lead Clown to discuss "Phase Two" of this thing, and found myself - once again - in the frikken Twilight Zone!!!

Bozo now willnot pay for exam, and wants reimbursement for refresher course!
Bozo also figures I should not take certification exam, and only school Employees as to "Easiest" way to pass exam.

Nevertheless, the entire thing was nullified soon after the sillyness mentioned.

Would be very difficult for me to explain the exam's details, to Employees of former 3-ring Circus, without knowing WHAT IT LOOKED LIKE, or HOW IT WAS GIVEN!!!

I still plan to take the exam, it's just become a "tad bit sour" subject, due to the Big Top's influences.

After I have completely vented my frustrations that built up at "Bozo's Big Top", the subject will be different!

Scott35

Sorry.

OK, here's the newest update.
(the subject was brought up in the Pictures for Discussion area by e57)
Out of the estimated 75,000 to 90,000 people that are working as electricians, only 4363 were certified by June 7th. That's from 4.8% to 5.8%.

-------That's Absolutely Pitiful-------
Here's the link

Now what????

You're right there Electure!.
And with only 139 working days left until the 01-01-05 deadline, if I was in this boat, I'd be getting my A into G and doing something about it now, to avoid the rush later on.
5.8%?, that's ridiculous!.

I have taken the test! And, I'll tell you it was NOT easy. I passed with just under 90%, (86,or 87, I think. I have it on the paper somewhere...)but I consider myself fairly good with the book! The Contractor exam is a cake walk in comparison. We have most of our guys studing now, to take it soon. A lot of the test is little details in the Code, and noticed most of it was "changes" in the '96 to '99, and '99 to 02. So if you studied, or memorized, or just plain remember things from other than the '99, you are doomed! (ESL, doomed!)Look everthing up twice, and cross check. A lot of questions have exceptions, and multiple codes. You definately need to know how to cross-refferance, and look it up. Read the section, and any refferance, look that up, read that, and often you'll find near exact wording of the question! Easy stuff for any foreman, or project manager, but the grunts are going to have a hard time at this! And, I think that's the idea.............

Personal opinion,I think this a take over of "Entry to the Trade", if not the Trade itself. This is the end of "Casual Apprenticeship"! Note: This is not being done by the CSLB!

Mark,
The processes you describe for passing the test are, IMO, just skills needed for looking something up in the Code book anyway!!
BTW, there's no '02 Code involved, it's straight out of the '99, and is open book.

Hint= Look for the key phrase in the question to begin your search for the answer. You'll find them nearly all answered verbatim.

There are many companies out there that have "foremen" with 2 yrs experience supervising "journeyman" with 6 months experience and "helpers" with 2 weeks experience, none of which have ever even seen a Code book.

(If at all possible, I'd like to keep this thread going until this thing is done. Everyone, please...let's stay away from the "politics" of the issue, so we don't end up with a big padlock on it)...S

Scott:

I agree and would like to be of assistance.

What are the requirements for the instructors?

I lived in Glendale and Pasadena and was their Electrical Inspector in the 70's and 80's for a while and understand.

Do they use the 1999 NEC without amendments? How about Los Angeles and the County?

Joe - I just signed up for a prep calss thru the local hall, and they tell me to just bring a '99 NEC period. That's it.

So, I guess the '99 NEC is the basis of the entire process.

Radar

99 NEC. No amendments to worry about as the '99 NEC was adopted as the 2001 CEC. (California Electrical Code) That is what is in force here.
Joe as far a LA goes it is a test at the State level so any local amendments do not apply. As far as I know there is now requirements for instructors.

[This message has been edited by Nick (edited 06-16-2004).]

Electure,
True, the test is ALL '99 NEC! But, as an observation, without getting specific and posting all the questions I saw... It was as if, someone took a list of changes and developed a major portion of the test from it! Anyway, my point was, look up EVERTHING. Especially, the things you know, or think you know!

As for the "Foreman" thing, and ways to get around taking the test. (Mentioned earlier in the thread.) Foreman, or should I say Fore-Persons, (There's one in our Company) don't need to take this test! So long as they plan NEVER to pick up tools again. As this law is worded to this effect. My personal opinion is that, if anyone should be taking this test, it should be Foreman, and Project Managers! I have watched this law for the last three years, and how it has changed. That is one thing, I would like to see changed.

For those interested, this is a link to the wording of the Law as it stands now. http://www.dir.ca.gov/DAS/AB931regs.html
I suggest everyone take good read of it if they do bussiness in California.

As for Scott35... I would've sent this direct to you, but think it is relevent for all effected by this law.

I have, along with our Project Manager, been giving classes to our guy's. And, dare I say it, we do it on our own time! Our Cheif BOZO has found in the grace of his heart to pay for a brush up class, (which we didn't find exactly relevant!) and the test! Which he did not have to do, because this "our" Certification, not his. He thinks some of the guy's will bolt after they pass it! (I think he looks at it as a write off, not to mention a good training standard. And, he ends up with better guys, he can use more effectively. Maybe you should bring this up your current Big Top!) Certification, also does not end with the test! You must prove "Continuing Edjucation", and activity in the Trade every three years. The rules for this are still vague!

Anyway, here's some advice for test prep:

Brush up on Ohm's Law, Kirchoff's Law, etc. AC, DC Therory, Series, and Parallel! These items are 20% of the test, listed as "Princables", and "Fundementals".

The rest is all '99 NEC! Right out of the book. Like I said before look up EVERYTHING! (I suggest study from a Handbook version, as there is alot of useful commentary in them! And, helps the student reconize where items may be in need of discovery, or cross refferanced to something else.) And, drill through finding answers to questions. (Joe can help you with that, he has some posted somewhere I'm sure.) I throw a book at my guy's on the job, and make them look up what they are doing a lot! This is how I learned years ago!

As for the test, you are provided a copy of the '99 NEC, and the NFPA regular version is the only type you can bring in. (Not the Handbook version, or the other Mcgraw Hill version! This one http://www.buildersbooksource.com/c..._id=C9YUpvbY&mv_pc=221&location= ) And, they check every book for any marking or modification. (There's a guy who wrote a book that suggested cutting up a code book "with a band saw", three hole punching it, and re-arranging it for easy refferance. He has Tabs he can sell you too! Too bad they won't allow it in the test site! It wasn't a bad, or expensive book, but written before the testing started.) They also provide a calculator, scrap paper, and a pencil.

The Test is done on a computer, and looks and operates EXACTLY like this: http://www.experioronline.com/demos.htm

As for test stratagy: Guessing and then going back, is NOT advised! You have 4 hours to go through this! My opinion is to go through each question, look it up, move on. Then go back, and double check everything! You need a 70% to pass, it would be really stupid to walk out with a 69%! (Expensive too!)

If you Pass, kudos to you! If you don't..... DO NOT REPRESENT YOURSELF AS BEING "CERTIFIED" AFTER JAN 1,2005! Get caught at this, you will not be allowed to take the test for FIVE YEARS! You'll essentially be kicked out of the Trade!

Anyway, I've run on a bit about this. I have made a HOBBY out of this law for a while now!

And, now that is the law of the land, I have been advocating for edjucation about it! It may get post-poned, (agian) but it is NOT going to go away!

e57,
Scott35 could pass this test with his eyes closed. It was just a bad day. (He probably could write a better test) I suggest you look at our "Theory" forum and the "Technical Reference" Area. I don't think he'll be brushing up on Ohm's Law

Joe,
There's no "official" schooling offered by the State. There are courses being offered by many of the same companies that offer Contractors License classes. Also the Asoociated Building Contractors and the IBEW have classes.
The CEC is essentially the '99 NEC, with the addition of CA's Title 24 Energy Regulations.
Local amendments are limited to administrative, topographical, climatic, etc., and must be submitted and approved by the State. The LA and LA County Codes are the CEC, amended almost solely by administrative regulations. The LA Codes look like "mere shadows of their old selves".



[This message has been edited by electure (edited 06-17-2004).]

electure,
I did not intent to incinuate that Scott "Brush Up" on anything. But the persons he would be preping should! And, I was putting that out for everyone, not exactly for him. After all it is 20 points!

As for the Schools, the JATC has a great on-line course, that you can get access to through you're Local. I've seen it, it's not bad. ABC should have a decent course too! They have been really involved in this issue since day one. Some of the other coures out there... I'd say "buyer beware". The boss bought into a package deal for half the crew, like ten guys. The study packs showed up, and for lack of a better phrase, were "a little weak!" Which is why we started doing more in house.



[This message has been edited by e57 (edited 06-17-2004).]